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The Rejected Realms; Est. 07 Feb 2011
Topic Started: Feb 7 2011, 08:15 PM (2,021 Views)
HEM
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Technical Difficulties, please stand by

Welcome!
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crazygirl
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The Rejected Realms

Thanks :)

Our next update should be coming out this week, so stay tuned ;)
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crazygirl
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The Rejected Realms

Posted Image

Government

Discussions on a government progressed rapidly, with general consensus amongst members on how it'll be structured. Things have since stalled slightly, since no-one particularly wants to do the next step and actually draft a constitution. Hopefully we'll stop being lazy and get that done by the time the next update is out. The intention is to keep things fairly simple, and to not tie ourselves up in laws. The discussion can be found here.

Foreign Affairs

The Foreign Affairs Department has been working hard, recently opening an embassy with The South Pacific, bringing our total number of embassies up to 20.

Anur-Sanur

Well-known troublemaker Anur-Sanur had a slight meltdown, with it eventually being revealed that he was working with NeeNee (Pristine Angel) on her plans to take over the region. The two fell-out, and TRR residents have been enjoying the various chat-logs posted on the forums since.

Manetheren River

Slightly less well-known troublemaker Manetheren River turned up on the forum, wrote several walls-of-text complaints about the leadership of the region, and now seems to have decided to leave. Late Addition: Biyah confessed that he was Manetheren River. Life in TRR is never boring....

The Rejected Realms Army

The RRA has been busy ensuring the security of the region, and is keeping a close eye on the various endo-swappers sitting in TRR. If you want to help out, it's currently looking for intel operatives.

Lolcats

The following conversation prompted a flurry of TRR lolcats to be made:
Quote:
 
* @Naivetry pokes at Krull gently
<@Krulltopia> yes?
<@Naivetry> U liek our forumz, then?  :P
* +Dali gasps at Nai
<@Krulltopia> ....
<@Krulltopia> did you just meme at me?
<@Naivetry> um. 
<@Naivetry> <_<
<@Naivetry> maybe?
<@Naivetry> >_>
<+Dali> that needs to be chatlogged
* @Naivetry is clearly in need of sleep.
<@Naivetry> noooooo, no chatlogging the bad grammar.
* @sedge will be adding that to the next update
<@Wham> wow, I could correct Nai's grammer, and spelling for one
* @Wham decides not to though
<@CrazyGirl> grammar
* @Naivetry had to stop herself from typing 'teh bad grammerz' just now.
<@sedge> lol
<@Wham> heh, I AM used to it though. :P
<@Naivetry> apparently when tired I become a lolcat.
* +Dali pats Nai
* @Wham chatlogs that too
<@Naivetry> -_-
* @Naivetry is providing much entertainment, it seems.
* +Dali tosses Nai a cheezburger
* @Wham hugs Nai
<@Naivetry> cheezburger!!! nomnomnom
* @Wham also provides Nai with chocolate covered coffee beans
<@Naivetry> oh my gosh, did I just say that?
<@CrazyGirl> Yup, you did
<+Dali> LOL
<@Naivetry> ...
<@Wham> we going to need yo u to breathe though this tube as hard as you can
<@Naivetry> If I'm still awake after midnight tonight, someone take away my keyboard.
* @Wham puts the breathalizer to Nai


Later on...

Quote:
 
<@sedge> hmm, I should make a Nai lolcat...
<@Biyah> mmmhmmm


There are now over 30 lolcats of TRR members in this thread.

Whampire

It was revealed on #TRR that Whamabama is actually a Twilight vampire:

Quote:
 
* @Wham takes CG to our own person crypt
<@sedge> crypt? That sounds... creepy
<@Wham> it's not
<@sedge> if you insist
* @CrazyGirl screams for help
* @Wham wonders why CG is screaming for help
<@Wham> Is not your hubby enough?
<@CrazyGirl> I'm handcuffed and dragged into a crypt
<@Wham> crypt +bedroom silly.
<@Wham> crypt = bedroom
<@sedge> Wham's a vampire
* @Wham uses slang
<@sedge> He's a Twilight vampire
<@Wham> don't make me hurt you
* @sedge admires Wham's sparkly skin
<@CrazyGirl> ooooh shiny
* @Wham dies
* Wham is now known as Wham|dead


Werewolves in the vicinity are advised to take caution.

Other Stuff

  • A "Dear CG" thread has been started here. Those in need of advice may find it helpful. Alternatively, they may not.
  • CrazyGirl decided to set up a Cult of Naivetry on the forums, with Biyah as Head Priest. Feel free to leave her offerings.
  • Wham recently died on IRC, and was given the kiss of life by Sedge. He was last seen with a loaded shotgun, looking for revenge.
  • CrazyGirl had to be comforted on IRC after watching a particularly scary movie. Apparently the death scene in Bambi caused her to burst into tears and hide behind her sofa.
  • If this update isn't funny enough for you, this should make you laugh.
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crazygirl
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The Rejected Realms

Here's the latest update, written by Sedge:

Quote:
 
Posted Image


Constitutionalised

Apparently that is a word! Yes, after weeks of wrangling, we finally have a Constitution. You can view this document in all its glory, here. Principal contributors to the document were Wham, Sedge and Naivetry - the latter insisting on keeping it short, whilst CG posted several times in the thread to complain that the constitution didn't declare her "Supreme Empress of The Rejected Realms". Don't worry, we still love her.

Officers Elections

Following on from the Constitution passing, elections for the Officer positions will be commencing. Officers are the government officials who run the region under the direction of the Delegate. So far, just one candidate has been announced - Sedge. At least you'll keep getting these updates...

Embassies Opened

Continuing with the self-promotion, the Foreign Affair Department (the only government department...) has been busy. Sure, it's well over a month since we wrote an update, but we've been doing stuff behind the scenes. Opening embassies, closing embassies (which reminds me - if you haven't got this update, we probably closed your embassy... not that you'll read this... oh well). There may have been some other stuff too - we really can't remember.

Gameside Embassy Policy

On a similar subject, NationStates now has embassies within the game itself. Our embassy policy remains the same as ever - applications have to be made on the forums, and we expect regular updates, or we'll close your embassy (occasional special exceptions depending on the generosity of the Foreign Affairs Minister - or the generosity of the bribes sent to him). This means that if you request an embassy in-game, it'll be rejected if you haven't already got one established on the forums.

CG's Commendation

Returning to the 'everyone loves CG' topic, there's currently a Commendation of Crazy Girl at vote in the Security Council. Vote for or she'll beat you up.

IRC

Well we don't have quite so many funny IRC quotes as last time. This moment of pure randomness will have to do:

<@CrazyGirl> .............................................
<@sedge> ?????????????
<@CrazyGirl> bAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
<@Krulltopia> ...
<@sedge> mooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
<@CrazyGirl> woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooof
<@Krulltopia> cluck?
<@sedge> miaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaow
<@CrazyGirl> peeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep
<@sedge> oiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiink
<@CrazyGirl> iiiiiiiiiiiiaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
<@sedge> squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeak
<@CrazyGirl> beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeh
<@sedge> cock-a-doodle-dooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
<@CrazyGirl> grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrroooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooowl
<@sedge> hoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooowl
<@sedge> I think that's probably enough? :P
<@CrazyGirl> yeah
<@Wham> ya, I was about to start kicking. :P

Other stuff

  • Legitimately Elected Regional Dictator Naivetry™ has been enjoying the new RMB suppression feature. Ad-spammers should pay attention to the requirements in the WFE if they want their posts to survive.

  • Literally months after CG nagging us to decide on one, we have a regional song: Hey Joe by Jimi Hendrix. Citizens are expected to listen to it at least 5 times a day, whilst saluting a burning guitar.

  • The forums reached 30,000 posts, Sedge reached 1,000. Milestones ahoy!
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crazygirl
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The Rejected Realms

And the latest update, again written by Sedge!

Posted Image

Update No. 6, April 2011

Officer Elections Over

The Rejected Realms now has a government, with the successful conclusion of Officer elections. At the time of our last update, just Sedge was running, but in the days afterwards, Unibot, Biyah and Dalimbar all threw their hats in the ring and joined in the race. With four candidates, and four vacant positions, it was little surprise to see all four confirmed as Officers. Delegate Naivetry allowed the Officers to pick their roles, resulting in the following government line-up:

  • Naivetry (delegate)
  • Sedge (foreign affairs)
  • Unibot (mobilisation)
  • Biyah (domestic affairs)
  • Dalimbar (media)
The Officers have been hard at work since taking up their positions.

TRR Roleplay

Defying its status as a gameplay region, The Rejected Realms now has a 1984 themed roleplay going on, run by Biyah. This has already attracted a number of posters, and the infamous Cult of Naivetry has been assigned to the roleplay section too.

Media

Media Officer Dalimbar has been busy setting up newspapers. The Rejected Times is the highbrow newspaper, covering serious events within the region and the NationStates world. The Mop and Pail is our trashy tabloid, and the first edition can be read here. The NS Crossfire IRC debates of 2009 have been revived, and will be starting again shortly.

Mobilisation

Unibot has been contacting new members of The Rejected Realms in order to get them active on the forums. This has already proved successful, with several new registrants on the RR forums. We hope to see even more in the future.

Sedge Condemned

As retaliation for Commend Crazy girl, CG wrote, submitted, and campaigned for the WA Security Council proposal 'Condemn Sedgistan', which passed by a significant majority, resulting in Sedge being the first person in NationStates to be both Commended and Condemned. Work will start shortly on Liberating him...

Crazy girl modded!

Yep, that's a pig you see flying past your window. Crazy girl has now joined fellow Rejected Realms resident Sedgistan on the ebil NationStates mod team. Rumours that this was done to stop CG posting her 'I want my magic powahs!" threads have been strenuously, if unconvincingly, denied.

IRC log of the month

Quote:
 
<@Nai|Dinner> NS has ruined politics for me. I look at stuff going through our state legislature, and I feel like telling people, "i c wut u did thar and I hate u all"
<@CrazyGirl> Someone quote her on that.
<@sedge> it's going in the next update
<@CrazyGirl> Thanks, Sedgey
<@CrazyGirl> Sorry, Nai :P


All that other stuff that I can't quite be bothered to write more than a sentence about

  • Sedge was recently lynched for uploading a Twilight theme on the forum for April 1st. Apparently Whamabama led this, after learning his account was re-named 'Whampire' for the day.
  • WANTED! More of these posters, please...
  • A new thread, Blame Sedge was started, with participants invited to say what they blame sedge for. Unfortunately the thread veered off-topic, with some posters deciding to blame Wopruthien instead. Sedge has been blamed for this threadjack.
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crazygirl
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The Rejected Realms

Statement on events within The South Pacific

The Rejected Realms decided not to intervene during Devonitian's recent coup in The South Pacific, believing that the people of The South Pacific should have the right to choose their own delegate. We were deeply disturbed to find that the ousted government of The South Pacific did not share our conviction. Instead of relying upon the endorsements of TSP natives, Southern Bellz and other members of TSP's forums called on their personal friends from outside regions such as Qwendra and on the assistance of the FRA in their attempt to regain power.

While we do not approve of Devonitian's use of post suppression and banjection to silence opposition, neither can we excuse the sense of entitlement to power demonstrated by Southern Bellz and her government. Tradition alone does not give any group of nations the right to control the delegacy of a feeder. That right - that privilege - belong only to those communities who actively work to foster growth in NationStates.

The government of TSP cannot claim to be such a community. On Oct. 29, 2010, The Rejected Realms requested an embassy with The South Pacific. Our request was approved on Feb. 7, 2011 after numerous inquiries from our officials; but in the months since we have heard nothing from The South Pacific either in our embassy or theirs - no acknowledgment of our updates, and not even a request for aid during Devonitian's coup.

This silence is only one example of basic dysfunction within the putative government of TSP. Southern Bellz's loss of the delegacy was not the failure of an individual, but of a government system fatally disconnected from the region it was meant to serve. Instead of directing their energies towards caring for and connecting with the nations of their region or even with other regions in NationStates, members of The South Pacific's forum turned inward, enjoying the prestige and publicity of controlling a feeder without exerting any effort to nurture community in that feeder in return. Instead of reaching out to nations in The South Pacific, forum members expected activity to come to them; it should not have come as a shock that Devonitians was happy to oblige.

When Kandarin handed over his nation to Naivetry in October 2010, TSP's delegate Southern Bellz refused to exchange embassies with The Rejected Realms (in contradiction of standing TSP policy) on the following grounds:
Quote:
 
I feel uncomfortable opening an embassy with The Rejected Realms at this due to the fact that I think the nation handing that went on is a underhanded technique that underminds game play. Considering my platform as delegate is a very pro-game play stance, I feel by accepting the embassy, I acknowledge this type of delegate transfer as legitimate.

In relying on outside forces to prop up a delegacy lost to a native-endorsed challenger, Southern Bellz and the government she represents used an underhanded technique to ensure their continued hegemony over ordinary nations in The South Pacific, undermining gameplay and its requirements of continued activity from the delegate. By maintaining the embassy, we would be acknowledging this type of delegacy monopoly - one predicated on a refusal to engage with the natives of the region - as legitimate.

In light of recent events, therefore, The Rejected Realms has no choice but to suspend diplomatic relations with The South Pacific. Additionally, we do not at this time recognize Southern Bellz as the legitimate delegate of The South Pacific.

If the forum-based community of The South Pacific wishes to be recognized as the legitimate government of TSP, they must legitimize themselves not only to each other or to outside kingmakers such as the FRA, but to the people they claim to represent: the nations of The South Pacific. Until we are satisfied that the regional forum is no longer held aloof and isolated from the region itself, The Rejected Realms cannot recognize the forum government of TSP as the legitimate voice of the region.

We will continue to monitor the situation, and when we are satisfied that the sitting delegate, whoever that may be, has been legitimized by the community within the region itself, we will reconsider this decision. Until then, our thoughts and best wishes are with all the nations of The South Pacific.
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unibot
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Champion of the Oppressed

You're talking to yourself... they're unrecognized, remember? :wacko:


... someone had to say it. :P
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Southern Bellz
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I would just like to respond to a few claims that this embassy update contains.

If you would like to break off diplomatic relations with The South Pacific, that is your region's call, but a lot of this information is not correct, and I will attempt to correct them.

The first is the fact that I had to rely on outside help to reclaim the delegacy of this region is a flat out lie. All attempts foreign nations made to aid us in reclaiming the region were repelled by Devon, WHILE Devon invited or allowed multiple foreign nations to endorse him. Your nation, along with the Crusaders of Justice flags were the two that I recognized, and multiple other puppet nations which came at update propped Devon up for the second update. I will say this, in most situations like this that I have seen people create a string of alter egos and puppets in order to act, you at least showed us the respect of using your main nation.

What caused Devon to lose power was the massive loss of native endorsements.


The most confusing point you make in this entire passage is the fact that you blame The South Pacific for requesting aid from other regions, and in the same passage site the fact that The South Pacific did not request foreign assistance from The Rejected Realms, which is simply not true as well. A request was made to Sedge for assistance, and he told me he forward my request to the Rejected Realms Army. I apologize that an official embassy cable was not sent.

Sorry if you respond to this next section, I made a mistake and am correcting it in an edit. It is regarding the embassy situation you brought up. I apologize for the decision to not open up an embassy, it was both in violation of regional policy, and a decision I would not make today. My thinking at the time was the fact that an embassy represented something more than a means of communication at the time, and that is evident in my post. Communications between regions should remain open, IMO, no matter what the cause is. I don't just say that as a response to your region wishing to cut communication with our government. You may not believe that, but at the same time, I have allowed The West Pacific to have communications with the region still. (With the exception of Punk Daddy, who has a standing ban on our forum, as per his request).

So I honestly apologize. I did not agree with Kandy's actions of handing down his region, but I should not have rejected an embassy because of it.

If you honestly feel that this government does not represent the region of The South Pacific, then we invite you to contribute to the conversation about the reforms we will be considering over the next few, and suggest methods of reform.

In accordance with our embassy policy, we will leave this embassy open, in the event that The Rejected Realms wishes to resume diplomatic contact.

EDIT: I would also like to point out the fact that in an interview with Devon: http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=114473

They claimed the following fact, "Some people have attributed my loss to the FRA, which is a laughable claim. Their troops (all 3 of them) were swatted aside at update like flies."

EDIT2 is an in text edit
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Southern Bellz
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unibot
May 26 2011, 06:57 PM
You're talking to yourself... they're unrecognized, remember? :wacko:


... someone had to say it. :P

Please don't inflame this situation Unibot, there is nothing ridiculous about telling a region you are breaking diplomatic ties with them.
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Biyah
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*rolls his eyes*
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HEM
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Technical Difficulties, please stand by

I agree fully with Southern Bellz here. I find this statement bizarrely undiplomatic.
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Daytime to Night


For a region that changed the delegate nation from one player who had held the delegacy for years to another in his circle of friends, who was barely even a Rejected Realms native, this statement seems rather laughable.

Seem to remember the ambassador being up in arms about that...

Funny how things can change so much in six months.
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sedge
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Member

Daytime to Night
May 27 2011, 08:19 AM
For a region that changed the delegate nation from one player who had held the delegacy for years to another in his circle of friends, who was barely even a Rejected Realms native, this statement seems rather laughable.

Seem to remember the ambassador being up in arms about that...

Funny how things can change so much in six months.

Quite. Those of us who originally supported the handover (myself, Naivetry, others) came to realise what a mistake it was. We did something about it. We got nations involved on our forum (every single nation in TRR was telegrammed) and held a democratic election to choose our own delegate.
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LadyRebels
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I Somlenly Swear I am Up To No Good....

and I am going to guess that Nav/Kandy won it? cool :D

OOC: side note thing I honestly loved it when I got back to NS and TGed Kandy to say hello, Nai let me know right off the bat what had happened. Just thought I would mention how cool that was :)
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Southern Bellz
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sedge
May 27 2011, 07:52 AM
Daytime to Night
May 27 2011, 08:19 AM
For a region that changed the delegate nation from one player who had held the delegacy for years to another in his circle of friends, who was barely even a Rejected Realms native, this statement seems rather laughable.

Seem to remember the ambassador being up in arms about that...

Funny how things can change so much in six months.

Quite. Those of us who originally supported the handover (myself, Naivetry, others) came to realise what a mistake it was. We did something about it. We got nations involved on our forum (every single nation in TRR was telegrammed) and held a democratic election to choose our own delegate.

You can say a lot of things about me, but the one thing I always am is honest, and that may rub you the wrong way, but you can quote my posts from a few years ago and I am able to tell you what I mean/meant at the time. From what I am reading, you guys are not being honest with me.

You are saying you are breaking ties for so many different things, when there is direct contractions in the reasoning.

The first issue I have is what you say about the statement I made about not opening an embassy right away. I'll start by reiterating the fact that my final judgement of not opening an embassy was a mistake, both by regional regulations and personal judgement. But, what I said at the time was not a mistake, and Sedge just agreed with me, the way Kandy handed the delegate seat to Nai was a mistake. Then Sedge said that they came to realize it was a mistake. How did you come to realize it was a mistake? I would venture to guess it was because people like me spoke out. But hey, mistakes happened, and you guys, as Sedge claimed, DID fix the situation. Then we felt comfortable opening the embassy. And the whole time we left diplomatic lines open. This situation was not handled perfectly, but I find it hard to believe that it is worth breaking diplomatic communication over.


Now, I want to be clear what I am saying. I am in NO way saying that I should get credit for The Rejected Realms going through the effort of fixing the mistake they made. The credit goes to people like Sedge, Crazy Girl and the rest of the RR who did the hard work. But in essence, that what you guys are saying about Devon, because he pointed out a mistake (be it in a much more harsh and unforgiving manner) that he deserves credit for noticing an error in The South Pacific. The thing is, he did it much more violently and drastically than my simple statement was. Just because you realize you can sneak a gun into a building, and can shoot it off, you don't get credit for pointing out a security flaw. You get credit if you warn the people that there is an issue, and work with them to fix it.


Sedge, I have a few personal question for you.

Can you confirm the fact that I asked you for aid, and you said you would forward the request to The Rejected Realms? Then told me that the request did go through, and that the decision of the RR was to not get involved in the situation.

Yet still, Crazy Girl endorsed the invader delegate.

Then, can you please explain, why you are saying that The South Pacific should have asked the RR for aid, THEN blaming us for asking other regions?

Also, I would like to ask, how can you claim that The South Pacific delegate position was reclaimed by foreign nations, when Devon directly claimed that they were able to repel the foreign nations that did come to our aid. While Devon was propping himself up with foreign nations, that were both transparent, and some that they admitted to.

If you guys want to site inactivity, fine, mistakes were made and there is really no excuse for the fact you guys didn't get embassy updates, but to make these contradictory claims with direct evidence to point out otherwise and spread it around NS is unfair to us.

If I am incorrect please explain to me how I am incorrect, instead of rolling your eyes at my response.
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Todd McCloud
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Has tea in the Sahara far too often.

sedge
May 27 2011, 07:52 AM
Daytime to Night
May 27 2011, 08:19 AM
For a region that changed the delegate nation from one player who had held the delegacy for years to another in his circle of friends, who was barely even a Rejected Realms native, this statement seems rather laughable.

Seem to remember the ambassador being up in arms about that...

Funny how things can change so much in six months.

Quite. Those of us who originally supported the handover (myself, Naivetry, others) came to realise what a mistake it was. We did something about it. We got nations involved on our forum (every single nation in TRR was telegrammed) and held a democratic election to choose our own delegate.

Just as TRR was at a crossroads, so is TSP. I didn't support the handover for a number of reasons, but the fact you guys had elections over it to determine just who should be delegate, rather than handing it over, is good in my books.

Perhaps you'd have some advice for folks here, seeing as you guys got a previously inactive region more active while at the same time not destroying its legacy? I have a feeling some here are resistant to change, partly due to tradition, perhaps partly due to thinking they don't need it, but also partly due to being a little afraid of it.
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Daytime to Night


sedge
May 27 2011, 07:52 AM
Daytime to Night
May 27 2011, 08:19 AM
For a region that changed the delegate nation from one player who had held the delegacy for years to another in his circle of friends, who was barely even a Rejected Realms native, this statement seems rather laughable.

Seem to remember the ambassador being up in arms about that...

Funny how things can change so much in six months.

Quite. Those of us who originally supported the handover (myself, Naivetry, others) came to realise what a mistake it was. We did something about it. We got nations involved on our forum (every single nation in TRR was telegrammed) and held a democratic election to choose our own delegate.

And what do you think a weeks worth of debate on the RMB, numerous threads on here (I can see about 4 all talking about elections!), removing bans to get more people involved in those discussions etc is all about?

The only difference is that our delegate was legitimately elected by other members whereas your delegacy changed hands in a manner that was "fatally disconnected from the region it was meant to serve", in this case a changeover discussed behind closed doors within Kandarin and Naivetry's social circle. Oh and one other difference is that your regions 'friends' didn't all seem to try and interfere with you lot working it out - like they have here from some imaginary moral high ground.

I really am surprised you can't see the hypocrisy of all this sedge.

But the final straw has to be your description of Devon as a 'native-endorsed challenger', considering that several of the many foreign WAs propping Devon up came from your own region.
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LadyRebels
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I Somlenly Swear I am Up To No Good....

You know in all honesty why are we trying to justify things? What happened happened and we need to put it behind us as a lesson learned. What lesson is that? The lesson that you can not be so disconnected from the Region that you are part of that you loose the identity of that Region.

As to Devon, I talked with the leader of that Nation and honestly he did state to myself that the Nation was created in TSP. Do I believe that? Not sure, but I would like to take those words at face value.

As to the Members of TRR or FRA that was here in TSP, honestly last I checked we all have the right to move and do what we want with our endorsements, so you can't hold a whole Region/Government Body responsible for what a Nation does with itself...(Just a thought)

You know there was a time when TRR and TSP was close, it really saddens me to see that we have lost that, as it seems we have lost a lot of close friendships with the other Feeder Regions.

It is time to reclaim what we have lost. TSP used to be full of Forward Thinkers, Fun Times and Laid Back Friendships....reclaim it people and honestly let go the grudge you think you have a right to hold.

It is a new day in TSP now get to work on it.....(oh Goddess flash back to MATT)
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Naivetry
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Right, so... in the past couple of weeks we've discussed elsewhere some of the points brought up in this thread. Please forgive the wall of text I'm about to leave for you; if you intend to read it all, I recommend going to get a glass of water or a cup of coffee first. :P

I wanted to start by bringing up Todd's post, because it's one I wholeheartedly agree with. Our job as friends of TSP should have been to offer what advice we could to help, rather than just poking at our embassy application and muttering to ourselves. That said, a few weeks ago I spent some time talking to HEM, and we agreed that a lot of the back-and-forth between TSP and TRR, beginning with the hand-off of Kandarin and ever since, has been part of larger debates over how to play the game, rather than coming from any real animosity between our regions or members. Both of us thought, too, that that discussion has the potential to grow... and, hopefully, move away from mutual criticism towards something productive.

So, while I'm not sure we can really take credit for the activity that's come to TRR, I can tell you what we did as a community to change the way we were seen by others, and maybe some of that will help as TSP goes through a similar process here.

Our initial statement above, posted by Sedge as our FA Officer at the time but written by me, drew on our experience with dissidents in TRR (Biyah as Manetheren River, and Anur-Sanur) who had argued that our forum was disconnected from our region. And the criticism had a fair basis in reality. The nation handoff had proven how great of a mistake that attitude had been, and I had started trying to bring it back to the community of TRR by asking what the people on the forum wanted me to do. But the discussions with nations like Manetheren River and Anur pushed us to expand our idea of community beyond the forum to all the nations of the region. When we held elections, then, we sent a personalized telegram to every nation (WA or non) that had been in the region for two weeks or more, encouraging them to register to vote.

I don't think either of our antagonists had expected us to take the criticism that seriously - or to do anything about it if we did. That's what changed things for us, though. Because people criticized us for not being open to newer players, we bent over backwards to make sure that no one could believe it was true. I've seen that response in the past couple weeks from TSP, too, in the elections and telegram campaigns in the aftermath of the coup, and it's been a truly impressive testament to the strength of TSP's community.

If there's any advice I can offer from being a few months ahead in this process, it would be 1) keep telegramming new nations, 2) take possession of your RMB, 3) don't be afraid of change, and 4) don't get involved in scandals. :P And enjoy the ride. Just a few words on those points, and then I'll get off my soapbox and stop talking. ;)

1) For me, it's not enough to sit back and wait for people to come to our forums. In the feeders, nations end up in our regions without any effort on our part... so as I see it, it's our responsibility to go that extra step and invite them to become part of our community. It's a heck of a lot of work, which is why we all tend not to do it... but for me, at least, it's worth every minute for the satisfaction of knowing that we have done literally all we can to make people welcome. After that it's up to them, and no one can blame us if people choose to ignore our invitation.

2) We're probably not going to agree on the suppressing adspam-that-does-not-contribute issue, but I think encouraging discussions on the RMB is one of the great joys of NS - especially with the new permanent RMB system. And it shows new players that there's an active and welcoming community taking part in a conversation that they can be part of, too.

3) TRR's a bit different from TSP, because we have so many players (all of them, actually, by definition) coming to us from other regions... and we have no choice about who gets to stay. But maybe that's what has made this next point more important for us than for anyone. When we set up our Constitution, we did so with the understanding that other people might come in and try to change us, and change the way we did things. But I believe that the danger of being taken over or changed against our will is a risk we all have to take. What gives each of us the right to run our regions is that we care about them... and if other people truly care for our regions, too, then the change those people bring will just be part of what it means to grow together as a community. While it may sound naive, I really believe that our love for our regions will win out over other people's quest for power every time. People like being part of something greater than themselves. And when you call on them to do that - to put the community and the region first - I've found that people will join with you, rather than stand against you.

4) "Don't get involved in scandals" should be pretty obvious, given what's happened to TRR in the last few weeks. :P But with that said, I am hopeful that TSP and TRR, at least, can begin to move past all the drama. I would understand if, given that it was an Officer of TRR who couped TSP, you were a little hesitant to open relations with us again so quickly. But we have appreciated hearing from LadyRebels and from Topid on our forums already, and that has been an encouraging sign.

And on that note, I'll shut up now. If there's anything we can do to help with the current silliness on the RMB, just let us know. :)
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Belschaft
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I think I agree with pretty much all of that Naivetry. We shouldn't let the actions of a small number of players - no matter how prominent - spoil our relations for ever. It's time for us all to move on, and looks to the future.

I was particularly pleased at how quickly you offered us TRR's support in the current situation.
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Naivetry
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Well, when someone showed up and started making our arguments (badly) after I thought they no longer applied... I figured we had better make it clear that 1) even we didn't buy the 'disconnected from the region' line anymore, and 2) faking evidence is Bad Form, yo.
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Antariel
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TSP's Black Elephant

Good to see TRR returning to it's embassy - as a player who only really got active in the coup, I'd like to think I won't be judgemental at your region :)

You made some points I strongly agree with, and TRR's message of support in the recent 'bout of stupid' was very much appreciated, thankyou. When we find the puppet master, there will be a mandatory series of 'NS etiquette', under threat of locking them in a room with Carta for a week just to see what happens (my feeling is rapid insanity, I imagine Carta would agree :P)

Thanks for taking the time to contact TSP, hope to see more of you around here; not sure if HEM is planning on being an ambassador in return to TRR, but if not I'll probably take that role.

Thanks again,

A.

:ele:
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HEM
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Technical Difficulties, please stand by

A strong statement. I hope this dialogue is only the first in a series of exchanges that we rebuild the ties between our two regions.
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LadyRebels
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I Somlenly Swear I am Up To No Good....

Thank you Nav and way cool on the advice, it shall be followed.....lol has already been followed somewhat...and I got to get back over to TRR and say hi again, been gone the past couple of days from my home computer.

Thank you for the eats on the RMB today it was great to start the day off with some TRR BBQ :)
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Antariel
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TSP's Black Elephant

I declare this embassy reopened! *ceremonially cuts a ribbon*

*embassy collapses*

Ooops....

*builds shinier new embassy*
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