Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
We have moved to http://tspforums.xyz/. Please join us at the new site.
This forum is archived and posting has been disabled. You do not need to register to access previously hidden areas. If you see any personally identifiable information, please alert the current Admin Team so that it can be moved to a private setting.
Welcome to The South Pacific Forums. We hope you enjoy your visit.


You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free.


Join our community!


If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Locked Topic
NS Revising Delegate Endorsement Method; My thought, not actuality
Topic Started: Jan 17 2005, 09:02 PM (267 Views)
TOOL a HOO
Member Avatar


With this election and reviewing a few thoughts of the game, I came to the conclusion that Nation States should revise the Delegate endorsement method.

Here's my problem. We have had a rash of bad UN resolutions, that I feel polute my nation. In fact, the only reason I stay involved with the UN is so that I can play my part in the region and most important, endorse. Also, since I don't really care much about the resolutions, I could never run for delegate. Because during the running process, I would get torn apart by the opposition for that very reason.

Here's my point. Wouldn't it be advantagious for NS to find a more "diversified" way to endorse a delegate rather that ONLY being involved and directly effected by the UN?

Let's hear it folks.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Jack_Tarr
Exhaulted Master - Dominion of Darryayah

I have no ideas about how else to endorse but I am in total agreement that I would like to see it. I too would bail from the UN in a minute if I could still be active in NS and TSP.

IMHO, much like in RL, the UN in NS all too frequently sticks its nose where it doesn't belong.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Caer Rialis
Member Avatar
Asleep

Actually, the endorsement process is fine. I'd look to change the mechanics over the Delegate's approval and vote totals for resolutions.

As it stands, the Delegates vote on whether or not a UN Resolution will make it to the floor of the UN. They then get the same number of votes for those proposals as they have folks endorsing them. This is an awful lot of power, power which should perhaps be cut.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
kloister
Member Avatar
Fudgie's 'Fronk'...

IMHO I think that there is definately substance for further discussion and debate on both the original thought voiced by TaH and the comments of CR...

One possible way forward is to split the actual endorsements down into a sub category...Those that want to be apart of the UN so that they can endorse the Delegate etc. But do not want to be affected by the poor quality of the majority of UN resolutions that make it to the members...

I suppose its a 50% membership...Wonder if that would work?..

This might also influence the reducing of the overall power of the delegates...
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
tsrill
Unregistered

Quote:
 
As it stands, the Delegates vote on whether or not a UN Resolution will make it to the floor of the UN. They then get the same number of votes for those proposals as they have folks endorsing them. This is an awful lot of power, power which should perhaps be cut.


I think this was the whole intention of the UN resolutions thingy when the game was designed. I have the feeling that talking control of a region just for the sake of having control of it wasn't anticipated by the game designers, but added later by the players, and has taken most of hte priority.
I can imagine that if you detach the UN resolutions from the delegacy powers, no one (or a small minority) will be interested in the UN. (Not that I care much if they are gone)

I think that a large majority of players vote yes on every resolution that's brought up for voting. Only if you have a really, really, really bad resolution it won't make it.

Goto Top
 
TOOL a HOO
Member Avatar


Maybe something like UN Member and Non-UN Member. Somehow, you still have to register 1 nation to have the ability to endorse a delegate and so forth, yet not be bothered with the UN sanctions. If this was possible, this would cut the power directly but the amount of nations not voting at the UN.

I never vote, simply put, I would resign from the UN today if I could still endorse a Delegate.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
htz3
Member Avatar
Former Delegate Member of COG

okay mind if I play the Devils advocate?

Let me start with The regional vote.

It is true when the Delegate of TSP casts the regional vote it counts for a great deal. It could in a tight race swing the vote.

We have between 1150-1300 UN's in TSP at any given time.

Now lets consider this should a region that has only half as many total nations as we have UN's vote count as much as our dose in relationship to the regional vote. The purpose of the regional vote was so that even if the UN Nations of a region chose not to vote or didn't know about UN resolutions they would be represented by the Delegate. At least that is my understanding of the regional vote if someone knows different please correct me.

As far as changing the way the Delegate is endorsed.

There has to be a way to endorse the Delegate and every one else for that matter. The only requirement is that You are a UN nation. Don't forget the Delegate is in truth The Delegate to the UN fromWhatever region.

In truth I think it may have been better if they allowed all UN nations to approve the resolutions in the Que. That of course would lead to mass problems I suppose.

As far as approving resolutions I must get 10- 20 tyg's a week from ppl asking me to look at and approve their resolutions. I have taken to only approving those that are at least well written. They all stomp on your sovereinty(sp?). That seems to be what people are interested in tell everyone what to do.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Ignignoct


There is one way to prevent bad Un Resolutions. There should be a Committee of 12 called "The Patriots" in which will vote to see if the resolution should continue for a vote or not.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Black Adder
Premier of the Pacific

Interesting idea but I've no idea how you'll get Max to agree to it. I remember from the beginning of the game he was against modifying the game in any way for proposals save dropping the quorum. Reasoning for this was the nightmare in reprogramming made it essentially impossible. It was a bare bones simple structure with no real way to modify it. You may have some success in petitioning him for the NS2 project but its pretty far along. You may want to check out the applicable Jolt forum.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
TOOL a HOO
Member Avatar


Black Adder
Jan 31 2005, 07:52 PM
Interesting idea but I've no idea how you'll get Max to agree to it. I remember from the beginning of the game he was against modifying the game in any way for proposals save dropping the quorum. Reasoning for this was the nightmare in reprogramming made it essentially impossible. It was a bare bones simple structure with no real way to modify it. You may have some success in petitioning him for the NS2 project but its pretty far along. You may want to check out the applicable Jolt forum.

Well yah, I fugured the game has been going on long enough that a "drastic" change like this would quickly be kyboshed. And in the NS FAQ it does say that the game was meant to be played for a 4 month span. Also, I remember NS2 being developed over a year ago. Frankly, I am surprised its still a go. I'll check it out.

Thnx
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Ignignoct


But we can make "The Patroits" in a forum, pick 12 smart people, and any UN resolution has to be pasted by them in order to be voted by all UN members. Its like the Security Council.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
htz3
Member Avatar
Former Delegate Member of COG

It would still require a rewrite in the game script so I would doubt that it would be considered. Just being realistic here.

Not a bad idea though.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Caer Rialis
Member Avatar
Asleep

Ignignoct
Jan 31 2005, 09:44 PM
But we can make "The Patroits" in a forum, pick 12 smart people, and any UN resolution has to be pasted by them in order to be voted by all UN members. Its like the Security Council.

I think that is a terrible idea. Which twelve would you choose? Which twelve are acceptable? How do we prevent this oligarchy from simply stopping all UN activity?

What I would prefer is this.

1) Delegates have the right to review proposed resolutions. Once they have been approved by enough delegates, they will be passed onto the full membership of the UN.

2) All UN members receive a single vote. There is no bonus for being a delegate. One nation, one vote
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
tsrill
Unregistered

And, instead of, or additional to, a notice that say a resultion is incorporated into your nation, a telegram that a new resolution is up to vote. Much more useful IMO...

-Tsrill
Goto Top
 
htz3
Member Avatar
Former Delegate Member of COG

Wouldn't bother me cr that way I could vote the first day and not have 3 days of people calling me irresponsible for not voting and removing their endos from me.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Dickvandyke
Wouldn't you like to know

tsrill
Feb 1 2005, 07:08 AM
And, instead of, or additional to, a notice that say a resultion is incorporated into your nation, a telegram that a new resolution is up to vote. Much more useful IMO...

-Tsrill

That would be a great idea, especially for lazy people like me.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
LadyRebels
Unregistered

You do realize that in the wind up of all this, that the Regional Vote of not really the Regional vote, right?

In the game there is no button that says the Delegate votes for the Region, it is because of the poll here that it makes it a Regional Vote, any Delegate, at anytime can put a stop to the polling and vote the way that they want to.

Just a thought to put out there *rubs hands together* can't wait to see the response to this comment...... :boogey:
Goto Top
 
Geomania
Former Minister of Security/other stuff

LadyRebels
Feb 6 2005, 04:02 AM
You do realize that in the wind up of all this, that the Regional Vote of not really the Regional vote, right?

In the game there is no button that says the Delegate votes for the Region, it is because of the poll here that it makes it a Regional Vote, any Delegate, at anytime can put a stop to the polling and vote the way that they want to.

Just a thought to put out there *rubs hands together* can't wait to see the response to this comment...... :boogey:

LR, you are absolutely correct. This sort of practice is done throughout NS.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
htz3
Member Avatar
Former Delegate Member of COG

Every delegate that I know dose it the same as we do as far as I know.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
Caer Rialis
Member Avatar
Asleep

LadyRebels
Feb 6 2005, 02:02 AM
In the game there is no button that says the Delegate votes for the Region, it is because of the poll here that it makes it a Regional Vote, any Delegate, at anytime can put a stop to the polling and vote the way that they want to.

True, and that's why the delegate should only have one vote when the proposal comes to the floor. The delegate has already had a voice in approving submitted proposals as part of the quorum; why, then, should a delegate have a greater voice than that?

Unless Max & co. are fans of dictatorships
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
tsrill
Unregistered

Actually, I think they are...
Goto Top
 
htz3
Member Avatar
Former Delegate Member of COG

caer_rialis
Feb 7 2005, 07:56 AM
LadyRebels
Feb 6 2005, 02:02 AM
In the game there is no button that says the Delegate votes for the Region, it is because of the poll here that it makes it a Regional Vote, any Delegate, at anytime can put a stop to the polling and vote the way that they want to.

True, and that's why the delegate should only have one vote when the proposal comes to the floor. The delegate has already had a voice in approving submitted proposals as part of the quorum; why, then, should a delegate have a greater voice than that?

Unless Max & co. are fans of dictatorships

Truthfully I agree with you CR I was just playing Devils advocate before.

We have a tremdous advantage over new regions even older rgions in the fact that people have a 1 in 5 chance of starting here. If they join the UN and do the issues and that is all they do and never check out what is available any other plce we can become extremly powerful possibly even swing a UN vote when the delegate casts the regional vote.
Offline Profile Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
« Previous Topic · Old News and Topics · Next Topic »
Locked Topic