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Barack Obama Speaks On Economy At Cooper Union
Topic Started: Mar 27 2008, 09:25 AM (605 Views)
Dandandat
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Time to put something here
Quote:
 
Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama is in the city today delivering a speech on the economy.

Obama spoke of financial equality, saying that the fact that there is currently an unequal distribution of excess is "no accident."

The Illinois senator was introduced by Mayor Michael Bloomberg when he spoke this morning at Cooper Union in the East Village.

The mayor has been friendly with Obama, sitting down with him in a "private" meeting last year.
Bloomberg has been mentioned as a possible vice presidential candidate and of course mulled his own bid for the White House.

The Independent has not endorsed anyone in the upcoming election, although he has hinted he would support a candidate who works to find bipartisan solutions.

http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=1&aid=79835


I was listening to this speech today on my way into work, while it started off a bit rocky it started to appeal to me about 10minets in.

He took a shoot at the Clinton's by saying the current economic poblems where born under their adminstration, which I wonder if he would have other wise admit too if he did not need to set himself apart from Clintion at this time.
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Admiralbill_gomec
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"financial equality" sounds too much like Socialism to me.

I read the speech. I was not impressed either by the speech or his "knowledge" of economics. I found the dig at Hillary amusing.

EDIT: I prefer to read his speeches instead of listen to them. Primarily because I get a better sense of what he is talking about, and dont' get swept up in the oratory "skills."
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RTW
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Dandandat
Mar 27 2008, 07:25 AM
Quote:
 
Obama spoke of financial equality, saying that the fact that there is currently an unequal distribution of excess is "no accident."

Since he's one of the few receiving that unequal distribution of excess perhaps he can shed some light on what illicit and immoral methods he used?
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Admiralbill_gomec
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^^^

But don't you understand? It's the evil corporations acting all... corporation-ey!
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 28 2008, 02:42 PM
^^^

But don't you understand? It's the evil corporations acting all... corporation-ey!

Well when people like hedge fund managers are the top earns in the country but pay a less percentage in tax then the rest of us, what he says makes some sense.


This reminds me of two guys I read about recently, they both lost their jobs doe to the financial difficulties of the past year. One lost his job when the factory he worked hard for closed down, the other was let go after losing his company a lot of money.


Quote:
 
After 30 years at a factory making truck parts, Jeffrey Evans was earning $14.55 an hour in what he called “one of the better-paying jobs in the area.”… Wearing a Harley-Davidson cap, a bittersweet reminder of crushed dreams, he recently described how astonished and betrayed he felt when the plant was shut down in August after a labor dispute. Despite sporadic construction work, Mr. Evans has seen his income reduced by half.
So he was astonished yet again to find himself, at age 49, selling off his cherished Harley and most of his apartment furniture and moving in with his mother.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/16/us/16ohi...exprod=newsvine


Quote:
 
Former Merrill Lynch & Co. Chief Executive Stan O'Neal has found a new home: Alcoa Inc., which Friday named Mr. O'Neal as a director.
The move came a day after Merrill Lynch reported a $9.8 billion loss for the fourth quarter, the worst in the firm's 94-year history. The results were driven by $16.7 billion in losses on complex securities, subprime mortgages and other debt that piled up as the bank took what ratings firms have said were excessive risks under Mr. O'Neal's watch….
Mr. O'Neal left Merrill with benefits valued at $161.5 million from various pension plans and stock grants.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1200695988...s_us_whats_news


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Admiralbill_gomec
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One problem with our capitalistic society is that we can't please everyone. While I'm sorry for the guy who lost his factory job, that's his responsibility, not the government's.

As for the guy who lost his job at Merrill Lynch, he should have been canned long ago. I will double check to ensure that none of my mutuals hold Alcoa. O'Neal is a shareholder problem. This is why I always vote my proxies. Also nothing Obama and his leviathan big government ideas should be sticking his nose into.

As for paying a lesser percentage, he still pays MORE total. That sounds a bit like class envy. Personally, I think I pay way too much. I'm in the top bracket, can't use a mortgage deduction, and am sheltering as much income as I'm allowed every year in my SEP IRA. Do I care if someone pays a lower percentage than I do but makes more? Not really.
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 31 2008, 10:27 AM
As for paying a lesser percentage, he still pays MORE total. That sounds a bit like class envy. Personally, I think I pay way too much. I'm in the top bracket, can't use a mortgage deduction, and am sheltering as much income as I'm allowed every year in my SEP IRA. Do I care if someone pays a lower percentage than I do but makes more? Not really.

Well I do, and it's not class envy, simply what's fare and not fare. If everyone else in the country pays a certain tax on their "income", yet a whole group of people side step this by categorizing their "Income" as "investment" there is a problem. It doesn’t matter if they pay more or lese, it doesn’t matter if the tax code itself is unfair in other ways. In this one regard it is wrong and should be corrected. When Obama refers to such practices I can not do anything but agree with him.


I would also say that Jeffrey Evans plight is a shareholder issue as it is his own. Since you feel sorry for the guy that must mean there is something wrong with the situation, otherwise why feel sorry? But why didn't you categories it as something shareholders can also take responsibility for as you did O'Neal? Labor is more then just a line item on the income statement, but more often then not they are simply seen as nothing more then a resource not unlike capital equipment.


As for O'Neal and being a shareholder issue I would agree; but his actions hurt more then just shareholders. It hurt people tied to Merrill Lynch as customers and it has compounded current market conditions that are affecting everyone. Further still not all shareholders are created equal, not everyone invested in Merrill Lynch lost do to O'Neals actions, and I would be willing to bet that many of those responsible for his severance package were not that displeased with him when they set up those funds and he was making the decisions that has lead to the current end. As often is true in such situation the CEO isn’t the only one making the bad decisions and his termination is nothing more then a 'show'.
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Admiralbill_gomec
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Dandandat
Mar 31 2008, 10:17 AM
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 31 2008, 10:27 AM
As for paying a lesser percentage, he still pays MORE total. That sounds a bit like class envy. Personally, I think I pay way too much. I'm in the top bracket, can't use a mortgage deduction, and am sheltering as much income as I'm allowed every year in my SEP IRA. Do I care if someone pays a lower percentage than I do but makes more? Not really.

Well I do, and it's not class envy, simply what's fare and not fare. If everyone else in the country pays a certain tax on their "income", yet a whole group of people side step this by categorizing their "Income" as "investment" there is a problem. It doesn’t matter if they pay more or lese, it doesn’t matter if the tax code itself is unfair in other ways. In this one regard it is wrong and should be corrected. When Obama refers to such practices I can not do anything but agree with him.


Even though Obama does it too?

Oh, and as far as what is fair and what isn't, life isn't fair. I've said this I don't know how many times, but YOU CAN NOT PLEASE EVERYONE. Lefty plans for fairness usually involve penalizing others. No thanks. This is one reason why I take everything I read from Obama and Hillary with an enormous grain of salt.
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 31 2008, 11:57 AM
Dandandat
Mar 31 2008, 10:17 AM
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 31 2008, 10:27 AM
As for paying a lesser percentage, he still pays MORE total. That sounds a bit like class envy. Personally, I think I pay way too much. I'm in the top bracket, can't use a mortgage deduction, and am sheltering as much income as I'm allowed every year in my SEP IRA. Do I care if someone pays a lower percentage than I do but makes more? Not really.

Well I do, and it's not class envy, simply what's fare and not fare. If everyone else in the country pays a certain tax on their "income", yet a whole group of people side step this by categorizing their "Income" as "investment" there is a problem. It doesn’t matter if they pay more or lese, it doesn’t matter if the tax code itself is unfair in other ways. In this one regard it is wrong and should be corrected. When Obama refers to such practices I can not do anything but agree with him.


Even though Obama does it too?

Oh, and as far as what is fair and what isn't, life isn't fair. I've said this I don't know how many times, but YOU CAN NOT PLEASE EVERYONE. Lefty plans for fairness usually involve penalizing others. No thanks. This is one reason why I take everything I read from Obama and Hillary with an enormous grain of salt.

Obama lives under the same rules as we all, and currently the system is set up so that "investment" income is taxed at a lower rate then other forms of income. You can't blame Obama for following the current rules and call him a hypocrite when he says he wants to change them. If he doesn’t change them once he is in office, you would have a point. But at this stage it is irrelevant whether he gained from it prior to having the power to change it.

If you don’t believe him that is of course a different mater and one every voter has to deal with.



Also yes, life is not fare; but that is not an excuse for not trying to make it so.
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Admiralbill_gomec
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^^^

The problem is, Dante, Obama's plans don't make anything more fair for anyone, just less fair for others.

As I said, no thanks.
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 31 2008, 01:08 PM
^^^

The problem is, Dante, Obama's plans don't make anything more fair for anyone, just less fair for others.

As I said, no thanks.

You would have to quantify that of course.
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Admiralbill_gomec
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Dandandat
Mar 31 2008, 12:14 PM
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 31 2008, 01:08 PM
^^^

The problem is, Dante, Obama's plans don't make anything more fair for anyone, just less fair for others.

As I said, no thanks.

You would have to quantify that of course.

I'll just quantify it by saying "soak the rich" which is what I read from Obama's speech. You like what he said. Fine. I don't. Why? Because his idea of "faiiiirrrrrrness" is to raise taxes on the better off and give it to people who just don't pay income tax. As I said, for the last time... NO THANKS.

That's typical of he and his ilk.

I just won't vote for this phony a**clown.
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
That's not a quantification its rhetoric.
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Admiralbill_gomec
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Dandandat
Mar 31 2008, 01:17 PM
That's not a quantification its rhetoric.

No, it is an OPINION, based on his speech and previous behavior of he and his party.

:wave2:
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
Admiralbill_gomec
Mar 31 2008, 02:50 PM
Dandandat
Mar 31 2008, 01:17 PM
That's not a quantification its rhetoric.

No, it is an OPINION, based on his speech and previous behavior of he and his party.

:wave2:

Rhetoric is often based on opinion, and is often the sighting of opinion with out explanation or example to back up said opinion.
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