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The Substance of Barack Obama; What does he stand for?
Topic Started: Jan 6 2008, 12:49 AM (1,247 Views)
RTW
Member Avatar
Vice Admiral
captain_proton_au
Jan 6 2008, 04:58 AM
Sorry to Republicans out there, but Huckabee and Romney are so .......

Substantive? Experienced? Qualified?

;)
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Minuet
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Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 06:33 PM
Minuet
Jan 6 2008, 04:47 PM
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 02:55 PM
Dr. Noah
Jan 6 2008, 04:55 AM
Jag, it is certainly untrue that all the chicks in your area do not shave their armpits and legs.  I have a friend who lives there, so I know of at least one.  Amazing how vast generalizations are made on people's age and/or political party on this site and nobody  bothers to call them on it. 

It's disturbing the criteria some people use to make thier voting decision.  A responsible voter checks voting records and the websites of the candidates to see the overall message of each.

Don't get excited or presumptuous dude, I am only asking the questions of his substance. I will hit his website very very soon. If it will please you I will keep you updated on my evolving opinion as I LEARN.

If these types of thoughts and discussions are offensive to you and / or seem like generalizations.....whatever dude. I don't hate the guy or his age or his race, I simply want to know more about Cloony's Rock star that everyone seems to be so enamored with and learn a substantive reason why.
NOT:
1. He's moving
2. He's attractive
3. He's Charming

You would admit thats fair wouldn't you? :huh:

I think he was refering to the comments about liberals not shaving. And frankly he is right. Those comments were not amusing.

Come on now, I grew up my whole life with women with shaved legs and armpits. To see something vastly different in real life is amusing. I don't hate on them or pick on them. Those comments were not over the top. It would be like you in Canada observing men who all shaved their body hair and commenting on it. Nothing deep, just a comment................. :wave2: :meditate: BTW I can't help the facts. They are Liberals By and Large, an assumption but a valid likely one I can live with. Keep Austin Wierd is a PRIDE thing in this town and it doesn't offend them. The Guy with the Mowhawk wants you to think he is wierd and different, it makes him feel good.

Don't take my word for it, ask some of them. :yes: Its all good and it is also quite amusing as are many things here.

Well as someone you would label a liberal I don't find such comments amusing.

Do you like the stereotype of conservatives as all redneck "good ole boys" with no brains?
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RTW
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Vice Admiral
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 04:33 PM
Come on now, I grew up my whole life with women with shaved legs and armpits. To see something vastly different in real life is amusing. I don't hate on them or pick on them. Those comments were not over the top.

There are groups you can joke about and groups you can't joke about. Learn the difference.

Remember, my uncle's brother's plumber's nephew's mail carrier's parents lives in Austin and that makes me as much of an expert on Austin as you and gives me an avenue with which to check your statements.
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Sgt. Jaggs
Member Avatar
How about a Voyager Movie
Minuet
Jan 6 2008, 07:03 PM
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 06:33 PM
Minuet
Jan 6 2008, 04:47 PM
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 02:55 PM
Dr. Noah
Jan 6 2008, 04:55 AM
Jag, it is certainly untrue that all the chicks in your area do not shave their armpits and legs.  I have a friend who lives there, so I know of at least one.  Amazing how vast generalizations are made on people's age and/or political party on this site and nobody  bothers to call them on it. 

It's disturbing the criteria some people use to make thier voting decision.  A responsible voter checks voting records and the websites of the candidates to see the overall message of each.

Don't get excited or presumptuous dude, I am only asking the questions of his substance. I will hit his website very very soon. If it will please you I will keep you updated on my evolving opinion as I LEARN.

If these types of thoughts and discussions are offensive to you and / or seem like generalizations.....whatever dude. I don't hate the guy or his age or his race, I simply want to know more about Cloony's Rock star that everyone seems to be so enamored with and learn a substantive reason why.
NOT:
1. He's moving
2. He's attractive
3. He's Charming

You would admit thats fair wouldn't you? :huh:

I think he was refering to the comments about liberals not shaving. And frankly he is right. Those comments were not amusing.

Come on now, I grew up my whole life with women with shaved legs and armpits. To see something vastly different in real life is amusing. I don't hate on them or pick on them. Those comments were not over the top. It would be like you in Canada observing men who all shaved their body hair and commenting on it. Nothing deep, just a comment................. :wave2: :meditate: BTW I can't help the facts. They are Liberals By and Large, an assumption but a valid likely one I can live with. Keep Austin Wierd is a PRIDE thing in this town and it doesn't offend them. The Guy with the Mowhawk wants you to think he is wierd and different, it makes him feel good.

Don't take my word for it, ask some of them. :yes: Its all good and it is also quite amusing as are many things here.

Well as someone you would label a liberal I don't find such comments amusing.

Do you like the stereotype of conservatives as all redneck "good ole boys" with no brains?

Min did you forget who you are talking to? :huh:
Why would you assume I would label you or anyone else a Liberal?

My record:
1. Vote for Clinton twice
2. Vote for Gore in 2000
3. Voted for Bush not Kerry
4. Don't know where I will vote next

I don't even know what I would label myself. I am conflicted in my opinion an several key issues. Maybe better in another thread, this Barack Obama thread may loose its continuity quickly.

I respect you Minuet, but more importantly I LIKE you. I hope you can tolerate things you don't find amusing with respect to me because I think you could persuade me in a number of areas with your wisdom.
I really mean that.

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Intrepid2002
Member Avatar
UNGH!
Dr. Noah,

My friend, my countryman, lend me your razor. ;)


Jag,

Seems as if that is the latest talking point these days. Is Obama a man of substance or style? Being a registered Democrat but not full out liberal (who by the way shaves her legs and armpits regularly) I oftentimes get a twang of deja vu when I hear Obama's claims that he is the agent of change, that he is the one who can bring the country together and bridge decades of political, social, economic and racial divide. I get flashbacks of George W. Bush promising to be a "uniter, not a divider", "Compassionate Conservative" and "reformer with results". IMHO, we are a country more divided than ever today.

I have read "Dreams of My Father" and "Audacity of Hope". Sadly enough, some people may consider it to be a unrealistically idealistic, feel good dissertation on Obama's optimism about America and attempt to find a middle ground between Conservatism and Liberalism. On the other hand, for some of us, it's more about a change in direction. After reading the book, I went away with the message that regardless of the position we as Americans find ourselves in the world, America still has the potential to offer hope to anyone regardless of their background. If you haven't read the book, it's not about stereotypical liberal assumptions but more about the promise of hope that America still offers to all.

Admittedly, this man has caught my attention maybe more because we have one similar experience that I can connect with and I have tried to find out what it is he truly stands for. Three minute soundbites from the media are not enough to make an educated and sound decision about the man. I will admit I am hungry for change yet I am still skeptical about this young rising star Barack Obama. Partisan and ideological fights have been going on for decades. It's hard for me to imagine how one election based on the promises of one man can erase all of that. Skeptic that I am, I will believe it when I see it.

In the meantime, I will continue to listen to his message. If he is voted to office, I suppose that is when we will see if he is a man of so called substance or not.

More later.

Correction. Titles should read: "Dreams from My Father" and "The Audacity of Hope"
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Sgt. Jaggs
Member Avatar
How about a Voyager Movie
Intrepid2002
Jan 6 2008, 08:02 PM
Dr. Noah,

My friend, my countryman, lend me your razor. ;)


Jag,

Seems as if that is the latest talking point these days. Is Obama a man of substance or style? Being a registered Democrat but not full out liberal (who by the way shaves her legs and armpits regularly) I oftentimes get a twang of deja vu when I hear Obama's claims that he is the agent of change, that he is the one who can bring the country together and bridge decades of political, social, economic and racial divide. I get flashbacks of George W. Bush promising to be a "uniter, not a divider", "Compassionate Conservative" and "reformer with results". IMHO, we are a country more divided than ever today.

I have read "Dreams of My Father" and "Audacity of Hope". Sadly enough, some people may consider it to be a unrealistically idealistic, feel good dissertation on Obama's optimism about America and attempt to find a middle ground between Conservatism and Liberalism. On the other hand, for some of us, it's more about a change in direction. After reading the book, I went away with the message that regardless of the position we as Americans find ourselves in the world, America still has the potential to offer hope to anyone regardless of their background. If you haven't read the book, it's not about stereotypical liberal assumptions but more about the promise of hope that America still offers to all.

Admittedly, this man has caught my attention maybe more because we have one similar experience that I can connect with and I have tried to find out what it is he truly stands for. Three minute soundbites from the media are not enough to make an educated and sound decision about the man. I will admit I am hungry for change yet I am still skeptical about this young rising star Barack Obama. Partisan and ideological fights have been going on for decades. It's hard for me to imagine how one election based on the promises of one man can erase all of that. Skeptic that I am, I will believe it when I see it.

In the meantime, I will continue to listen to his message. If he is voted to office, I suppose that is when we will see if he is a man of so called substance or not.

More later.

I completely and agree with your view as stated there about Obama. I just don't have a position other than that yet.

As for talking point about substance, the only person I have heard say that was Dennis Prager. He really tries to be fair and the idea struck a nerve in me which is why I made this post several days later.

I like the feedback because I want to vote for the best person for the job and want to know why I disagree with the other fellow.
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Minuet
Member Avatar
Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 07:57 PM
Minuet
Jan 6 2008, 07:03 PM
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 06:33 PM
Minuet
Jan 6 2008, 04:47 PM
Jag
Jan 6 2008, 02:55 PM
Dr. Noah
Jan 6 2008, 04:55 AM
Jag, it is certainly untrue that all the chicks in your area do not shave their armpits and legs.  I have a friend who lives there, so I know of at least one.  Amazing how vast generalizations are made on people's age and/or political party on this site and nobody  bothers to call them on it. 

It's disturbing the criteria some people use to make thier voting decision.  A responsible voter checks voting records and the websites of the candidates to see the overall message of each.

Don't get excited or presumptuous dude, I am only asking the questions of his substance. I will hit his website very very soon. If it will please you I will keep you updated on my evolving opinion as I LEARN.

If these types of thoughts and discussions are offensive to you and / or seem like generalizations.....whatever dude. I don't hate the guy or his age or his race, I simply want to know more about Cloony's Rock star that everyone seems to be so enamored with and learn a substantive reason why.
NOT:
1. He's moving
2. He's attractive
3. He's Charming

You would admit thats fair wouldn't you? :huh:

I think he was refering to the comments about liberals not shaving. And frankly he is right. Those comments were not amusing.

Come on now, I grew up my whole life with women with shaved legs and armpits. To see something vastly different in real life is amusing. I don't hate on them or pick on them. Those comments were not over the top. It would be like you in Canada observing men who all shaved their body hair and commenting on it. Nothing deep, just a comment................. :wave2: :meditate: BTW I can't help the facts. They are Liberals By and Large, an assumption but a valid likely one I can live with. Keep Austin Wierd is a PRIDE thing in this town and it doesn't offend them. The Guy with the Mowhawk wants you to think he is wierd and different, it makes him feel good.

Don't take my word for it, ask some of them. :yes: Its all good and it is also quite amusing as are many things here.

Well as someone you would label a liberal I don't find such comments amusing.

Do you like the stereotype of conservatives as all redneck "good ole boys" with no brains?

Min did you forget who you are talking to? :huh:
Why would you assume I would label you or anyone else a Liberal?

My record:
1. Vote for Clinton twice
2. Vote for Gore in 2000
3. Voted for Bush not Kerry
4. Don't know where I will vote next

I don't even know what I would label myself. I am conflicted in my opinion an several key issues. Maybe better in another thread, this Barack Obama thread may loose its continuity quickly.

I respect you Minuet, but more importantly I LIKE you. I hope you can tolerate things you don't find amusing with respect to me because I think you could persuade me in a number of areas with your wisdom.
I really mean that.

I respect you too (and like you :) )which is why I tried to make my point as nicely as I could.

I just don't want you going the way of others here........
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Sgt. Jaggs
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How about a Voyager Movie
understood :handshake:
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ds9074
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Admiral
There seems to have been a lot of attention on Obama's relative inexperience. I would say that experience is a double edged sword in government. Yes it means you know how things work but because you do you may be less open to radically reforming how they work.

Also experience is not necessarily a requirement for being a competent and successful leader. Tony Blair's first job in government was Prime Minister and when he was elected he defeated an incumbent with years of experience in various government jobs.

I can see some comparison between Blair's message in 1997 and what I have heard of Obama. Both good speakers. Both offering a message of change and new hope for the country. Both seeking to replace a tired conservative administration.

Blair's message of change and of reform was more popular that the old governments message of experience and consistency. He went on to govern resonably competently for 10 years and was successful enough to be re-elected twice.

The warning though is that while he was resonably competent he found, by his own admission, that it was harder to achieve the radical chance he promised than he first thought.

There is a risk if a candidate promises a lot, particularly if they are a good communicator and build up the hopes of the nation, but then cant fully deliver. It ends up turning people off politics in general.
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Admiralbill_gomec
UberAdmiral
captain_proton_au
Jan 6 2008, 02:41 AM
Jag
Jan 5 2008, 11:49 PM

For the love of God please tell me black Americans will not just vote for him because he is """"~~~~making history~~~~""""""""

A fair few white and hispanic americans as well




One of the reasons I voted Labour in the last election is solely cos I wanted to see our first female deputy PM

Um, why is it a big deal?

What ever happened to "I think _____ is the best qualified for the position."

Voting for someone because of sex or race is just silly.

EDIT: My choice in the presidential primary in 1996 and 2000? Alan Keyes, because I thought he was best for the job.
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somerled
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Admiral MacDonald RN
Admiralbill_gomec
Jan 8 2008, 12:51 AM

Voting for someone because of sex or race is just silly.


You are not wrong there .... I would also include - because of their religious orientation is even sillier.
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Sgt. Jaggs
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How about a Voyager Movie
The name of the thread has been modified to better reflect the ongoing purpose of the discussion at hand.

END Non-Moderator comment
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Sgt. Jaggs
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How about a Voyager Movie
Obama's poularity is now "on fire" according to the media.

I look forward to the debates after he wins his party's nomination.

Two candidates, One stage, answer the same question.
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Sgt. Jaggs
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How about a Voyager Movie
Well Obama is running away with popularity after South Carolina.
Link
Kennedys endorse Obama
OOPS :rolleyes:

I heard Barack on C-span say he will raise the minimum wage each and every year he is President. Is that possible?
Again he sound inspirational but what is he actually talking about? Hope for what? Change of what?
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
Jag
Jan 27 2008, 05:44 PM
Well Obama is running away with popularity after South Carolina.
Link
Kennedys endorse Obama
OOPS :rolleyes:

I heard Barack on C-span say he will raise the minimum wage each and every year he is President. Is that possible?
Again he sound inspirational but what is he actually talking about? Hope for what? Change of what?

Quote:
 
Provide a Living Wage: Barack Obama believes that people who work full time should not live in poverty. Before the Democrats took back Congress, the minimum wage had not changed in 10 years. Even though the minimum wage will rise to $7.25 an hour by 2009, the minimum wage's real purchasing power will still be below what it was in 1968. As president, Obama would further raise the minimum wage, index it to inflation and increase the Earned Income Tax Credit to make sure that full-time workers can earn a living wage that allows them to raise their families and pay for basic needs such as food, transportation, and housing -- things so many people take for granted.

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/family/#support-families


I wonder if he will also do this for all pay groups? Where I live and what I am paid I just come under making ends meet while I raise my family. If Barack increases the minimum wage, which is an inflationary pressure, and ties it to inflation how does he plan to combat increases in living expenses?

A quick example. Minimum wage is now $7.25 and we can all assume there are people who now work for $7.60 (an increase of inflation). So now all the people making $7.25 just got bumped to $7.60 and all the people already making $7.60 just saw a negative pressure on their income and a negative on their reward for working hard enough to see an increase in statues from minimum wage.

How does Barack plan to compensate these people? Its nice to say “I’ll increase minimum wage” but the process of actually doing so is not striate forward. He does not explain this on his webpage. To many of the candidates do not provide enough information
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