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| The Paranormal and Spirituality | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 26 2005, 09:00 AM (478 Views) | |
| who | Aug 27 2005, 11:02 AM Post #16 |
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Have light saber. Will travel.
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Dan, it sounds like you do not believe in God and that is certainly your choice. Many of my spiritual/religious experiences were far more "real" than my ordinary experiences. The one mind to Mind contact with God was the most "real" experience I have ever had. |
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| Dandandat | Aug 27 2005, 11:09 AM Post #17 |
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Time to put something here
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You are correct I do not believe in god, but if they comfort you I am glad that you have had the experiences you speck of. |
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| psyfi | Aug 27 2005, 01:21 PM Post #18 |
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psyfi
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We were talking about what Jesus might have meant by his words to Thomas and I offered an interpretation of those words as they related to the idea of paranormal experiences; clearly it was an interpretation that was different than Swidden's view. Isn't that acceptable on a discussion board? Hard to discuss anything if we all just have to affirm what everybody else says. You seem to be defending the need to doubt, so maybe what I said somehow offended this value you hold or belief you have. I didn't mean to offend by what I said, just offer an interpretation of what Jesus said. |
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| who | Aug 27 2005, 01:47 PM Post #19 |
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Have light saber. Will travel.
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I do not want this to be perceived as an attack in any form but is it your belief in death that comforts you? |
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| ImpulseEngine | Aug 27 2005, 01:50 PM Post #20 |
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Admiral
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Just curious: What exactly is "spiritual"? I ask this because I consider myself to be a deeply spiritual person, but I also consider myself to be an atheist. I think the term "spiritual" has different meanings for different people. For some, it is synonymous with a relationship with some God. For others it's more like "religious" as in any religion - those that include a God and those that do not. For still others, it's more synonymous with "love". Or it may be some combination of those. For me, it's about love, connectedness with other people, and maintaining high standards of morality especially in regard to how moral decisions affect other people. With my definition of spirituality, I don't think paranormal experiences are necessary. Someone who equates spirituality with religion or a relationship with God might find it helpful, but again I don't think it would be necessary. By the way, I have had 2 of what some may consider precognitive dreams. In both instances, I only remembered the dream as the actual event occurred (I tend not to remember my dreams anyway). In the second one, I was able to use my memory of the dream to know what would happen next just before it did. Frankly, it was kind of creepy. However, the first may have been nothing more than a trick of the mind. The second may have been the same because what I "remembered" and "predicted" also could have been logically expected. But it didn't convince me of a religiously spiritual world. I try to be open-minded about these things - believing neither that it was or wasn't precognitive. But that's also why I'm not convinced of anything. |
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| who | Aug 27 2005, 02:06 PM Post #21 |
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Have light saber. Will travel.
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IE, I think we each have different concepts for these two words. The dictionary is not very helpful as God is mentioned in both. I find that religious is often associated with organized religion and/or a belief in God. Spiritual seems to include more such as belief in higher states of consciousness or being that may not include God. I consider myself a Christian in the sense that I believe in Jesus Christ but I am not associated with organized religion and I do not believe everything in the Bible. I consider myself religious and spiritual. Although I have had many spiritual experiences while sleeping, my most profound were while I was awake. They had little to do with my usual world of perception but with an awareness that was more "real" and more profound than the usual. |
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| 24thcenstfan | Aug 27 2005, 02:29 PM Post #22 |
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Something Wicked This Fae Comes
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Moderator Comment Just as a reminder, this forum is designed to allow people to come and feel comfortable about discussing their beliefs. No one has to defend their beliefs or should be subjected to attacks by other members for holding a separate belief. End Moderator Comment |
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| Dandandat | Aug 27 2005, 02:34 PM Post #23 |
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Time to put something here
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I was not offended, nor did I mean my words to be saying you where wrong or that you should not relate your opinion. I was just offering the alterative to what you had said. Your words made it seem absolute and I thought it was prudent to say other wise. |
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| Dandandat | Aug 27 2005, 02:39 PM Post #24 |
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Time to put something here
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I don't quite understand what you are saying, death is not a belief it is a fact what happens afterword is where beliefs or lack there of come in. Where I am guessing you believe you will go to haven (or hell if you are a bad boy) I lake that belief so to me death is the end of existence. Now if you are asking me if this end of existence comforts me? I would have to say no. how could that comfort any one, knowing they are going to cease existing? But I will say death is not something I dwell on, some day this will all end so now is the most important time and I live my life that way the best I can. |
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| psyfi | Aug 27 2005, 02:53 PM Post #25 |
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psyfi
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It is interesting that my words made it seem absolute because after I wrote what I did and I was thinking about it, I felt that I was probably WRONG in my interpretation. I think, Dan, that there is always going to be some tension, or at least mild conflict, between those who believe that there is a God and those who believe that there is not a God and those who believe that it doesn't matter whether there is a God and those who believe that you can never really know whether there is a God, and so forth. All of these are not mere beliefs but beliefs that serve as foundational to our world view. A person who is strong in any one of these beliefs can sometimes be an annoyance to another who is strong in a differing view. I am not sure that there is much we can do about it. |
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| psyfi | Aug 27 2005, 03:01 PM Post #26 |
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psyfi
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I have known many atheists who were profoundly spiritual people in just the sense you have defined it. Like you, some had paranormal experiences. A dear friend of mine who was an atheist was content to explain such as "Life is a bigger than my current understanding of it." He felt no need to go farther and was quite content to leave it at that. |
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| who | Aug 27 2005, 03:53 PM Post #27 |
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Have light saber. Will travel.
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I do not understand this comment. |
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| 24thcenstfan | Aug 27 2005, 04:00 PM Post #28 |
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Something Wicked This Fae Comes
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Who, See the PM I am about to send you. |
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| who | Aug 27 2005, 04:05 PM Post #29 |
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Have light saber. Will travel.
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Dan, there is the expression (was it Marx?) who said that religion is the opiate of the masses. I believe in God because I think God is real. This may provide some comfort. I believe that the full realization of God will provide peace, joy, and love beyond human comprehension. I am not there now. What I am saying is that I do not believe in God just to provide some psychological comfort but because I believe God is true. For those that believe in death and that death is non-existence (I have been there), there is comfort. One does not have to worry about hell or something after death. Death also appears to bring peace and an end to all one's problems. I do not believe that death is a fact. |
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| 24thcenstfan | Aug 27 2005, 05:54 PM Post #30 |
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Something Wicked This Fae Comes
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I will have to disagree with that. I don't think feeling unworthy has anything to do with losing focus on God. A person could be very devout and talk to God 24/7 and still feel unworthy of God's grace. Personally, I think the main reason why people have so few experiences is because they are unworthy. I know in my heart that that is why I haven't. I think it is a form of punishment for our past deeds. This doesn't mean that there aren't other reasons why experiences don't occur. Losing focus on God could be one reason. |
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1:50 PM Jul 11