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Jihadist terrorists
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Topic Started: Jan 10 2005, 07:50 AM (2,295 Views)
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Dwayne
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Jan 13 2005, 11:46 PM
Post #46
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Profanity deleted by Hoss
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- cptjeff
- Jan 13 2005, 09:37 PM
really? our founding fathers respected the Bible, a book very similar to the quran (have you read both? I've read the bible and most of the quran- have you?) the insurgents want an invading force out. what were our founding fathers fighting? oh yes, that invading army- british, wern't they?
Maybe someone else would like to school you on the concept of freewill and its place within Christianity, and conversely what Mohammadeans think about the concept of freewill.
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somerled
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Jan 14 2005, 12:57 AM
Post #47
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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- Admiralbill_gomec
- Jan 13 2005, 12:23 AM
I wonder if Somerled thought Saddam was uncorrupt, or served the people, or was a truly democratic leader? (Let's ask the 300,000 in unmarked graves who tried to ask Saddam the same thing, shall we?)
My opinion of Saddam is not relevent , in fact Saddam and Iraq were irrelevant and unrelated to the 9-11 and the war on terror until Bush decided he was and made it so.
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somerled
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Jan 14 2005, 01:00 AM
Post #48
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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- Dwayne
- Jan 13 2005, 11:46 PM
- cptjeff
- Jan 13 2005, 09:37 PM
really? our founding fathers respected the Bible, a book very similar to the quran (have you read both? I've read the bible and most of the quran- have you?) the insurgents want an invading force out. what were our founding fathers fighting? oh yes, that invading army- british, wern't they?
Maybe someone else would like to school you on the concept of freewill and its place within Christianity, and conversely what Mohammadeans think about the concept of freewill.
That's a philosophical cough out.
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Dwayne
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Jan 14 2005, 01:09 AM
Post #49
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Profanity deleted by Hoss
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- somerled
- Jan 14 2005, 12:57 AM
- Admiralbill_gomec
- Jan 13 2005, 12:23 AM
I wonder if Somerled thought Saddam was uncorrupt, or served the people, or was a truly democratic leader? (Let's ask the 300,000 in unmarked graves who tried to ask Saddam the same thing, shall we?)
My opinion of Saddam is not relevent , in fact Saddam and Iraq were irrelevant and unrelated to the 9-11 and the war on terror until Bush decided he was and made it so.
Just to reiterate... somerlad has no idea what he's talking about, and this is just another great example of how he writes endlessly about these things without providing a shred of evidence in support.
Since I'm not somerled, I'll do what I've done pretty consistently and he has never done ... provide the evidence in support of an argument.
Iraq had everything to do with the War on Terrorism. Iraq is/was a nexus in the War on Terrorism on at least four fronts. First, Osama bin Laden used the sanctions and enforcement regime against Saddam Husseins' Iraq, as well as the Palestinian issue to wield a populist pan-Islamist influence. Second, the Iraqi dictator, Saddam Hussein, played a significant part in the Palestinian uprisings and developed ties with al Qaeda. Third, Iraq under Saddam Hussein actively undermined the legitimacy of the United Nations sanctions against it. And forth, Saddam Hussein served as a model for those nations wishing to oppose the United States.
Osama bin Laden: Getting Friendly with the People Osama bin Laden had a long and extensive relationship with Abdullah Azzam; a man credited with helping to establish al Qaeda and Hamas and up until his death, was a well known Palestinian terrorist going clear back to the Six Days War [1][2][3].
In fact, Osama bin Laden has used the Palestinian issue as a point around which to rally support for his pan-Islamists cause [4], but it didn't stop with the Palestinians; Osama bin Laden also used the aftermath of the liberation of Kuwait as another point around which to rally support. An examination of Osama bin Laden's 1998 declaration of war against the United States makes this clear:
- Quote:
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First, for over seven years the United States has been occupying the lands of Islam in the holiest of places, the Arabian Peninsula, plundering its riches, dictating to its rulers, humiliating its people, terrorizing its neighbors, and turning its bases in the Peninsula into a spearhead through which to fight the neighboring Muslim peoples.
If some people have in the past argued about the fact of the occupation, all the people of the Peninsula have now acknowledged it. The best proof of this is the Americans' continuing aggression against the Iraqi people using the Peninsula as a staging post, even though all its rulers are against their territories being used to that end, but they are helpless.
Second, despite the great devastation inflicted on the Iraqi people by the crusader-Zionist alliance, and despite the huge number of those killed, which has exceeded 1 million... despite all this, the Americans are once against trying to repeat the horrific massacres, as though they are not content with the protracted blockade imposed after the ferocious war or the fragmentation and devastation.
So here they come to annihilate what is left of this people and to humiliate their Muslim neighbors.
Third, if the Americans' aims behind these wars are religious and economic, the aim is also to serve the Jews' petty state and divert attention from its occupation of Jerusalem and murder of Muslims there. The best proof of this is their eagerness to destroy Iraq, the strongest neighboring Arab state, and their endeavor to fragment all the states of the region such as Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Sudan into paper statelets and through their disunion and weakness to guarantee Israel's survival and the continuation of the brutal crusade occupation of the Peninsula [5].
Osama bin Laden laid out a near perfect, self-perpetuating multi-faceted strategy where the reason to wage war against America relied on the American enforcement of U.N. resolutions against Iraq from nations neighboring Iraq, the actual enforcement of those resolutions and the existence of Israel. The only thing Osama bin Laden needed to keep it going was a Saddam Hussein who did not capitulate to America and a Saddam Hussein who was willing to foster discontent with the Palestinians.
Underlying this multi-faceted strategy is the goal of eliminating the enforcement of sanctions against Iraq, the destruction of Israel and the removal of western foreign nationals from Muslim nations.
Saddam, the Palestinians & Connections to al Qaeda During the Iran/Iraq war, Saddam Hussein focused almost entirely on inciting Iranian rebellion, but in the lead up to the war to oust Iraq out of Kuwait, there was an important change in the tenor and focus of Saddam Hussein's rhetoric and support in that he attempted to wed himself with the Palestinian issue [5][6]. Some suggest that the relationship went beyond mere support to an active collaboration [7]. Some proof of this active collaboration is seen as Iraq retreated from Kuwait; some of those killed on the so called "Highway of Death" were Palestinians in Kuwait assisting Iraq [8].
In the years after the war, Saddam Hussein was treated as a pariah by most nations, but he always seemed to receive some sort of rhetorical support from Palestinians [9], and Saddam repaid that support with cold hard cash to those that carried out suicide attacks against Israel [10]. This played right into Osama bin Laden's war declaration against the United States, because as long as Hamas and other radicals refused to accept a peace settlement with Israel, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict would incite Muslims and rally them to him.
It's not necessary for Saddam to openly support Osama bin Laden for there to be a concerted effort towards some of the same goals. As well, there need not be open support of Osama bin Laden for the two powers to have numerous interconnections [11]. For Saddam, being primarily a secular ruler, supporting a religious person behind the scenes, like Osama bin Laden, fit perfectly with his egocentric self-perception of being the next Saladin [13].
Undermining the Legitimacy of the UN Sanctions As a result of Saddam Hussein ordering an invasion of Kuwait, Iraq had a score of United Nations Security Council Resolutions imposed against it, which Iraq and numerous western organizations actively attempted to circumvent [14]. For Saddam Hussein, the intent of this was so that Iraq could reconstitute its nuclear, biological and chemical weapons programs [15].
For the United States, a primary objective in the War on Terrorism is stopping the spread of WMD technology. A major mechanism in stopping that spread is agreements and resolutions nations make primarily through the United Nation and other non-governmental organizations.
A Model of Defiance Ever since the end of the war to liberate Kuwait, Saddam Hussein had his military repeatedly fire upon and otherwise tested American and British resolve in policing the no fly zones and in protecting the Kurds in the north and the Shia in the south [16]. Saddam's defiance against the United States served as a point of pride for many Arabs [17], which combined with the afore mentioned monetary payments for suicide attacks, can only foster an attitude throughout the Middle East that the United Nations was not seriously enforcing resolutions and that the United States would do nothing about it.
After Sept. 11th when America called for Middle Eastern nations to stop supporting terrorists and to arrest terrorists within their respective nations, more than any others, this warning was aimed at three nations, Syria, Iraq and Iran. Of those three, only Iraq had a long history of UNSC resolutions and open aggression against the United States upon which America could take action.
An Additional Point Geography is one of the most overlooked aspects of Iraq that makes it important to the War on Terrorism. Iraq is as important in the War on Terrorism as Normandy was to WW2, but for different reasons. Geographically, Iraq is a literal nexus between the Caucus to the north and Arabia to the south, the Mediterranean nations to the west and Persia to the east. Iraq is also a nexus religiously speaking where the two factions of Islam, Sunni and Shia, meet. Both factions have had a long history of fighting over this region in Asia Minor, with both making historical claims. In both instances, Iraq is an ideal location to interdict the worst elements as they migrate to and from different regions of the Middle East.
References: 1) "Abdullah Azzam: The godfather of jihad." By Chris Suellentrop ( http://slate.msn.com/id/2064385/ )
2) "Blowback" By Phil Hirschkorn, Rohan Gunaratna, Ed Blanche, and Stefan Leader - Jane's Intelligence Review - August 1, 2001 ( http://www.mwarrior.com/alqaeda.htm )
3) "ISLAMIC EXTREMISM: JIHADISM, QUTBISM, AND WAHHABISM" ( http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/429/429lect14.htm )
4) "Let the whole world know that we shall never accept that the tragedy of Andalucia (ph) would be repeated in Palestine. We cannot accept that Palestine will become Jewish." Osama bin Laden - October 7, 2001 ( http://www.assumption.edu/dept/history/His...in%20Laden.html )
5) "Jihad Against Jews and Crusaders" World Islamic Front Statement - 23 February 1998 ( http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/980223-fatwa.htm )
6) "Iraq insisted that withdrawal from Kuwait must be "linked" to a simultaneous withdrawal of Syrian troops from Lebanon and Israeli troops from the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights and southern Lebanon." ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War )
7) "Saddam Hussein and his apologists have recently sought to draw a parallel between the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and the current Iraqi occupation of Kuwait. Saddam argues that the Iraqi occupation of Kuwait is part of some great Mid-Eastern crisis directly related in some peculiar manner to the Israeli occupation of the West Bank, and that in order for an agreement to be reached in Kuwait, the Israelis must pull out from the West Bank." ( http://www-tech.mit.edu/V110/N37/yablon.37o.html )
8) "This is also the same Arafat whose agents aided in the Iraqi conquest of Kuwait in 1990. According to the Jerusalem Post, the PLO played a "critical role" in "facilitating the Iraqi military conquest of Kuwait and President Saddam Hussein's subjugation of the country." The Post revealed (in August 1990) that "much of the logistical planning for the Iraqi invasion was based on intelligence supplied by PLO officials and supporters based in Kuwait." In addition, "when Iraqi forces entered Kuwait City, intelligence officers were already equipped with the names, addresses, and telephone numbers of all key civil servants, industrialists and oil engineers in Kuwait, thus enabling the country to continue functioning almost without missing a beat." The information had been provided by the PLO. Thanks to Arafat, when the Iraqis arrived, they "went straight to their homes, picked them up, and ordered them to go to work," said an Arab diplomat quoted in the London newspaper Independent." ( http://www.afsi.org/OUTPOST/98APR/apr1.htm )
9) "A long convoy of retreating Iraqi troops — along with Iraqi and Palestinian civilians — formed along the main Iraq-Kuwait highway." ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War )
10) "Yasser Arafat was one of Saddam Hussein's strongest supporters when U.S. attacks were launched against Iraq five years ago. In the latest Iraqi crisis, Palestinian support is a day late and a name short." ( http://www.usatoday.com/news/index/iraq/nirq061.htm )
11) "A Hamas suicide bomber's family got $25,000 while the others - relatives of militants killed in fighting or civilians killed during Israeli military operations - all received $10,000 each." ( http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2846365.stm )
12) "The Iraq -- Al Qaeda Connections" by Richard Miniter ( http://www.techcentralstation.com/092503F.html )
13) "For the past few decades, Saddam has used these two figures in his propaganda. He has styled himself the successor to Saladin. Conveniently forgetting that Saladin was a Kurd, Saddam makes much of the fact that he and Saladin were born in the same little village of Tikrit." - "Does Saddam Think He's a Modern-Day Saladin?" By Eric H. Cline - 3-10-03 ( http://hnn.us/articles/1305.html )
14) "UN Security Council resolutions relating to Iraq" ( http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html )
15) "Saddam Husayn so dominated the Iraqi Regime that its strategic intent was his alone. He wanted to end sanctions while preserving the capability to reconstitute his weapons of mass destruction (WMD) when sanctions were lifted." and "Saddam wanted to recreate Iraq’s WMD capability—which was essentially destroyed in 1991—after sanctions were removed and Iraq’s economy stabilized, but probably with a different mix of capabilities to that which previously existed. Saddam aspired to develop a nuclear capability—in an incremental fashion, irrespective of international pressure and the resulting economic risks—but he intended to focus on ballistic missile and tactical chemical warfare (CW) capabilities." Duelfer Report - 30 September 2004 ( http://www.cia.gov/cia/reports/iraq_wmd_20...hap1.html#sect1 )
16) “The No-Fly Zone War” (U.S./U.K.-Iraq Conflict) 1991-2003 ( http://www.historyguy.com/no-fly_zone_war.html )
17) "Ten years after the start of the Gulf War, Palestinians still call Saddam Hussein a hero for standing up to an international coalition that fought to oust Iraqi invaders from Kuwait." - "Saddam is Palestinians' hero 10 yrs after war" - Shanghai Star - 2001-01-18 ( http://app1.chinadaily.com.cn/star/2001/0118/cn13-2.html )
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somerled
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Jan 14 2005, 01:17 AM
Post #50
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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- Dwayne
- Jan 14 2005, 01:09 AM
- somerled
- Jan 14 2005, 12:57 AM
- Admiralbill_gomec
- Jan 13 2005, 12:23 AM
I wonder if Somerled thought Saddam was uncorrupt, or served the people, or was a truly democratic leader? (Let's ask the 300,000 in unmarked graves who tried to ask Saddam the same thing, shall we?)
My opinion of Saddam is not relevent , in fact Saddam and Iraq were irrelevant and unrelated to the 9-11 and the war on terror until Bush decided he was and made it so. Just to reiterate... somerlad has no idea what he's talking about, and this is just another great example of how he writes endlessly about these things without providing a shred of evidence in support.
Since I'm not somerled, I'll do what I've done pretty consistently and he has never done ... provide the evidence in support of an argument.
Iraq had everything to do with the War on Terrorism. Iraq is/was a nexus in the War on Terrorism on at least four fronts. First, Osama bin Laden used the sanctions and enforcement regime against Saddam Husseins' Iraq, as well as the Palestinian issue to wield a populist pan-Islamist influence. Second, the Iraqi dictator, Saddam Hussein, played a significant part in the Palestinian uprisings and developed ties with al Qaeda. Third, Iraq under Saddam Hussein actively undermined the legitimacy of the United Nations sanctions against it. And forth, Saddam Hussein served as a model for those nations wishing to oppose the United States.
Osama bin Laden: Getting Friendly with the People Osama bin Laden had a long and extensive relationship with Abdullah Azzam; a man credited with helping to establish al Qaeda and Hamas and up until his death, was a well known Palestinian terrorist going clear back to the Six Days War [1][2][3].
In fact, Osama bin Laden has used the Palestinian issue as a point around which to rally support for his pan-Islamists cause [4], but it didn't stop with the Palestinians; Osama bin Laden also used the aftermath of the liberation of Kuwait as another point around which to rally support. An examination of Osama bin Laden's 1998 declaration of war against the United States makes this clear:
- Quote:
-
First, for over seven years the United States has been occupying the lands of Islam in the holiest of places, the Arabian Peninsula, plundering its riches, dictating to its rulers, humiliating its people, terrorizing its neighbors, and turning its bases in the Peninsula into a spearhead through which to fight the neighboring Muslim peoples.
If some people have in the past argued about the fact of the occupation, all the people of the Peninsula have now acknowledged it. The best proof of this is the Americans' continuing aggression against the Iraqi people using the Peninsula as a staging post, even though all its rulers are against their territories being used to that end, but they are helpless.
Second, despite the great devastation inflicted on the Iraqi people by the crusader-Zionist alliance, and despite the huge number of those killed, which has exceeded 1 million... despite all this, the Americans are once against trying to repeat the horrific massacres, as though they are not content with the protracted blockade imposed after the ferocious war or the fragmentation and devastation.
So here they come to annihilate what is left of this people and to humiliate their Muslim neighbors.
Third, if the Americans' aims behind these wars are religious and economic, the aim is also to serve the Jews' petty state and divert attention from its occupation of Jerusalem and murder of Muslims there. The best proof of this is their eagerness to destroy Iraq, the strongest neighboring Arab state, and their endeavor to fragment all the states of the region such as Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Sudan into paper statelets and through their disunion and weakness to guarantee Israel's survival and the continuation of the brutal crusade occupation of the Peninsula [5].
Osama bin Laden laid out a near perfect, self-perpetuating multi-faceted strategy where the reason to wage war against America relied on the American enforcement of U.N. resolutions against Iraq from nations neighboring Iraq, the actual enforcement of those resolutions and the existence of Israel. The only thing Osama bin Laden needed to keep it going was a Saddam Hussein who did not capitulate to America and a Saddam Hussein who was willing to foster discontent with the Palestinians.
Underlying this multi-faceted strategy is the goal of eliminating the enforcement of sanctions against Iraq, the destruction of Israel and the removal of western foreign nationals from Muslim nations.
Saddam, the Palestinians & Connections to al Qaeda During the Iran/Iraq war, Saddam Hussein focused almost entirely on inciting Iranian rebellion, but in the lead up to the war to oust Iraq out of Kuwait, there was an important change in the tenor and focus of Saddam Hussein's rhetoric and support in that he attempted to wed himself with the Palestinian issue [5][6]. Some suggest that the relationship went beyond mere support to an active collaboration [7]. Some proof of this active collaboration is seen as Iraq retreated from Kuwait; some of those killed on the so called "Highway of Death" were Palestinians in Kuwait assisting Iraq [8].
In the years after the war, Saddam Hussein was treated as a pariah by most nations, but he always seemed to receive some sort of rhetorical support from Palestinians [9], and Saddam repaid that support with cold hard cash to those that carried out suicide attacks against Israel [10]. This played right into Osama bin Laden's war declaration against the United States, because as long as Hamas and other radicals refused to accept a peace settlement with Israel, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict would incite Muslims and rally them to him.
It's not necessary for Saddam to openly support Osama bin Laden for there to be a concerted effort towards some of the same goals. As well, there need not be open support of Osama bin Laden for the two powers to have numerous interconnections [11]. For Saddam, being primarily a secular ruler, supporting a religious person behind the scenes, like Osama bin Laden, fit perfectly with his egocentric self-perception of being the next Saladin [13].
Undermining the Legitimacy of the UN Sanctions As a result of Saddam Hussein ordering an invasion of Kuwait, Iraq had a score of United Nations Security Council Resolutions imposed against it, which Iraq and numerous western organizations actively attempted to circumvent [14]. For Saddam Hussein, the intent of this was so that Iraq could reconstitute its nuclear, biological and chemical weapons programs [15].
For the United States, a primary objective in the War on Terrorism is stopping the spread of WMD technology. A major mechanism in stopping that spread is agreements and resolutions nations make primarily through the United Nation and other non-governmental organizations.
A Model of Defiance Ever since the end of the war to liberate Kuwait, Saddam Hussein had his military repeatedly fire upon and otherwise tested American and British resolve in policing the no fly zones and in protecting the Kurds in the north and the Shia in the south [16]. Saddam's defiance against the United States served as a point of pride for many Arabs [17], which combined with the afore mentioned monetary payments for suicide attacks, can only foster an attitude throughout the Middle East that the United Nations was not seriously enforcing resolutions and that the United States would do nothing about it.
After Sept. 11th when America called for Middle Eastern nations to stop supporting terrorists and to arrest terrorists within their respective nations, more than any others, this warning was aimed at three nations, Syria, Iraq and Iran. Of those three, only Iraq had a long history of UNSC resolutions and open aggression against the United States upon which America could take action.
An Additional Point Geography is one of the most overlooked aspects of Iraq that makes it important to the War on Terrorism. Iraq is as important in the War on Terrorism as Normandy was to WW2, but for different reasons. Geographically, Iraq is a literal nexus between the Caucus to the north and Arabia to the south, the Mediterranean nations to the west and Persia to the east. Iraq is also a nexus religiously speaking where the two factions of Islam, Sunni and Shia, meet. Both factions have had a long history of fighting over this region in Asia Minor, with both making historical claims. In both instances, Iraq is an ideal location to interdict the worst elements as they migrate to and from different regions of the Middle East.
References: 1) "Abdullah Azzam: The godfather of jihad." By Chris Suellentrop ( http://slate.msn.com/id/2064385/ )
2) "Blowback" By Phil Hirschkorn, Rohan Gunaratna, Ed Blanche, and Stefan Leader - Jane's Intelligence Review - August 1, 2001 ( http://www.mwarrior.com/alqaeda.htm )
3) "ISLAMIC EXTREMISM: JIHADISM, QUTBISM, AND WAHHABISM" ( http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/429/429lect14.htm )
4) "Let the whole world know that we shall never accept that the tragedy of Andalucia (ph) would be repeated in Palestine. We cannot accept that Palestine will become Jewish." Osama bin Laden - October 7, 2001 ( http://www.assumption.edu/dept/history/His...in%20Laden.html )
5) "Jihad Against Jews and Crusaders" World Islamic Front Statement - 23 February 1998 ( http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/980223-fatwa.htm )
6) "Iraq insisted that withdrawal from Kuwait must be "linked" to a simultaneous withdrawal of Syrian troops from Lebanon and Israeli troops from the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights and southern Lebanon." ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War )
7) "Saddam Hussein and his apologists have recently sought to draw a parallel between the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and the current Iraqi occupation of Kuwait. Saddam argues that the Iraqi occupation of Kuwait is part of some great Mid-Eastern crisis directly related in some peculiar manner to the Israeli occupation of the West Bank, and that in order for an agreement to be reached in Kuwait, the Israelis must pull out from the West Bank." ( http://www-tech.mit.edu/V110/N37/yablon.37o.html )
8) "This is also the same Arafat whose agents aided in the Iraqi conquest of Kuwait in 1990. According to the Jerusalem Post, the PLO played a "critical role" in "facilitating the Iraqi military conquest of Kuwait and President Saddam Hussein's subjugation of the country." The Post revealed (in August 1990) that "much of the logistical planning for the Iraqi invasion was based on intelligence supplied by PLO officials and supporters based in Kuwait." In addition, "when Iraqi forces entered Kuwait City, intelligence officers were already equipped with the names, addresses, and telephone numbers of all key civil servants, industrialists and oil engineers in Kuwait, thus enabling the country to continue functioning almost without missing a beat." The information had been provided by the PLO. Thanks to Arafat, when the Iraqis arrived, they "went straight to their homes, picked them up, and ordered them to go to work," said an Arab diplomat quoted in the London newspaper Independent." ( http://www.afsi.org/OUTPOST/98APR/apr1.htm )
9) "A long convoy of retreating Iraqi troops — along with Iraqi and Palestinian civilians — formed along the main Iraq-Kuwait highway." ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War )
10) "Yasser Arafat was one of Saddam Hussein's strongest supporters when U.S. attacks were launched against Iraq five years ago. In the latest Iraqi crisis, Palestinian support is a day late and a name short." ( http://www.usatoday.com/news/index/iraq/nirq061.htm )
11) "A Hamas suicide bomber's family got $25,000 while the others - relatives of militants killed in fighting or civilians killed during Israeli military operations - all received $10,000 each." ( http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2846365.stm )
12) "The Iraq -- Al Qaeda Connections" by Richard Miniter ( http://www.techcentralstation.com/092503F.html )
13) "For the past few decades, Saddam has used these two figures in his propaganda. He has styled himself the successor to Saladin. Conveniently forgetting that Saladin was a Kurd, Saddam makes much of the fact that he and Saladin were born in the same little village of Tikrit." - "Does Saddam Think He's a Modern-Day Saladin?" By Eric H. Cline - 3-10-03 ( http://hnn.us/articles/1305.html )
14) "UN Security Council resolutions relating to Iraq" ( http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html )
15) "Saddam Husayn so dominated the Iraqi Regime that its strategic intent was his alone. He wanted to end sanctions while preserving the capability to reconstitute his weapons of mass destruction (WMD) when sanctions were lifted." and "Saddam wanted to recreate Iraq’s WMD capability—which was essentially destroyed in 1991—after sanctions were removed and Iraq’s economy stabilized, but probably with a different mix of capabilities to that which previously existed. Saddam aspired to develop a nuclear capability—in an incremental fashion, irrespective of international pressure and the resulting economic risks—but he intended to focus on ballistic missile and tactical chemical warfare (CW) capabilities." Duelfer Report - 30 September 2004 ( http://www.cia.gov/cia/reports/iraq_wmd_20...hap1.html#sect1 )
16) “The No-Fly Zone War” (U.S./U.K.-Iraq Conflict) 1991-2003 ( http://www.historyguy.com/no-fly_zone_war.html )
17) "Ten years after the start of the Gulf War, Palestinians still call Saddam Hussein a hero for standing up to an international coalition that fought to oust Iraqi invaders from Kuwait." - "Saddam is Palestinians' hero 10 yrs after war" - Shanghai Star - 2001-01-18 ( http://app1.chinadaily.com.cn/star/2001/0118/cn13-2.html )
Where's the link to your source where cut and paste that from ? The blog it was taken from.
I'll read it later , when I get home , and maybe respond if I think it warants a response.
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Dwayne
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Jan 14 2005, 01:23 AM
Post #51
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Profanity deleted by Hoss
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You couldn't muster a response when I originally posted this, so I highly doubt you'll provide one this time around on this abbreviated version.
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somerled
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Jan 15 2005, 02:12 AM
Post #52
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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- Dwayne
- Jan 14 2005, 01:23 AM
You couldn't muster a response when I originally posted this, so I highly doubt you'll provide one this time around on this abbreviated version.
I would if I was convinced you were actually interested , but since you aren't ...
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Dwayne
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Jan 15 2005, 07:08 AM
Post #53
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Profanity deleted by Hoss
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- somerled
- Jan 15 2005, 02:12 AM
- Dwayne
- Jan 14 2005, 01:23 AM
You couldn't muster a response when I originally posted this, so I highly doubt you'll provide one this time around on this abbreviated version.
I would if I was convinced you were actually interested , but since you aren't ...
Oh, right ... someone who's not interested spends the time to type up a thousand plus words in an effort to show how disinterested they are.
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somerled
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Jan 15 2005, 09:43 AM
Post #54
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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- Dwayne
- Jan 15 2005, 07:08 AM
- somerled
- Jan 15 2005, 02:12 AM
- Dwayne
- Jan 14 2005, 01:23 AM
You couldn't muster a response when I originally posted this, so I highly doubt you'll provide one this time around on this abbreviated version.
I would if I was convinced you were actually interested , but since you aren't ...
Oh, right ... someone who's not interested spends the time to type up a thousand plus words in an effort to show how disinterested they are.
Easy to cobble together a 1000 words if you are lifting stuff from sites here and there , and pasting it in , and maybe making a occasional word change here and there.
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Admiralbill_gomec
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Jan 15 2005, 10:01 AM
Post #55
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It is also easy to read it, so why don't you.
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somerled
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Jan 15 2005, 10:50 AM
Post #56
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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- Admiralbill_gomec
- Jan 15 2005, 10:01 AM
It is also easy to read it, so why don't you.
What makes you think I didn't ?
(Even though is was only another Dwayne post and not likely to have anything worth reading in it.)
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Admiralbill_gomec
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Jan 15 2005, 12:06 PM
Post #57
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UberAdmiral
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Probably because I know your kind too well...
Besides, you just answered my question. If you had read it, you would have commented on it.
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cptjeff
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Jan 15 2005, 02:01 PM
Post #58
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Captain of the Enterprise-J
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Okay, you want comments? It's absolte BS that takes several reputable scorces on their own and twists it to meet your veiws. I noticed that one of those comments involved WMDs. yet you cite the Dulfer report, which said there were none. what does that mean? you took selective bits of data, ignoring the parts that you didn't want in there because it didn't bolster your argument.
Also, We're talking about Iraq. part of that was that suicide bombers got money from saddams government- well, in the same section, it claimed the checks were coming for Yasser Arafat's government.
I applaud you on learning to use cut and paste, and learning how to change the appearnce of facts when they don't suit you politically. Call Karl Rove, he might want you to help him out at putting out BS reports.
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Dwayne
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Jan 15 2005, 06:23 PM
Post #59
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Profanity deleted by Hoss
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- cptjeff
- Jan 15 2005, 02:01 PM
Okay, you want comments? It's absolte BS that takes several reputable scorces on their own and twists it to meet your veiws. I noticed that one of those comments involved WMDs. yet you cite the Dulfer report, which said there were none. what does that mean? you took selective bits of data, ignoring the parts that you didn't want in there because it didn't bolster your argument.
Also, We're talking about Iraq. part of that was that suicide bombers got money from saddams government- well, in the same section, it claimed the checks were coming for Yasser Arafat's government.
I applaud you on learning to use cut and paste, and learning how to change the appearnce of facts when they don't suit you politically. Call Karl Rove, he might want you to help him out at putting out BS reports.
Your comments do not constitute a rebutal even in the least bit.
You say I twist source, but don't not support that contention by actually proving it.
You claim I selectively quoted the Duelfer Report to support an argument, but you apparently never understood the argument or you're purposely acting obtuse. I wasn't making an about weapons, I was constructing an argument about Saddams attempt to undermine UN resolutions, and the passage from the Duelfer Report describes Saddams plan quite succinctly.
Even though I never made claims that suicide bombers were receiving money from Arafish and Saddam at the same time, it not mutually exclusive ... both could give money at the same time.
Hey child, the only thing I cut-n-pasted was the references, and your idiot quips in no way support your arguments. The only thing you can do to refute the argument I've constructed it to counter with facts that refute my fact and prove my conclusions wrong.
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somerled
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Jan 15 2005, 10:06 PM
Post #60
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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- Admiralbill_gomec
- Jan 15 2005, 12:06 PM
Probably because I know your kind too well... Besides, you just answered my question. If you had read it, you would have commented on it.
Did not comment or respond to it because I didn't consider it worthy of doing so. Simply not worthy the investment of effort to do so. Like I said - typical Dwayne garbage.
I think I indicated that would be my approach as soon as saw it. You can like that or you can lump it.
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