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One mistake Bush has made
Topic Started: Aug 20 2004, 12:31 PM (300 Views)
Dandandat
Member Avatar
Time to put something here
In my opinion one mistake that Bush has made is to overestimate the resolve, and spirit to work together of Americans and the west in general. After 9/11 the feeling in the air was that we got the kick in the pants we needed to open our eyes and see what was truly important, that we had the power to can come together and really change the world for the better. But only 3 short years latter it seems that it has returned to business as usual and the feeling of coming to gather has left, its once again every man for them selves, and when you look at it that is truly our greatest weakness – do bad they left that flaw out of the 9/11 report.
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Admiralbill_gomec
UberAdmiral
Another mistake he has made is that he has not stomped on the "insurgents" (i.e., terrorists).
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Hoss
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Don't make me use my bare hands on you.
Dan, you seem to be as frustrated by this as I am. :(
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Deleted User
Deleted User

That is a good point, i never really thought of that. It is a little sad really.
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gvok
Unregistered

I think Bush sqandered the good will of a large percentage of Americans and our allies by forcing an invasion of Iraq on flimsy grounds.
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Dandandat
Member Avatar
Time to put something here
gvok
Aug 20 2004, 01:42 PM
I think Bush sqandered the good will of a large percentage of Americans and our allies by forcing an invasion of Iraq on flimsy grounds.

To tell you the truth, I don’t see it that way at all. I think it was inevitable and Bush had little to do with it. We just cant put something’s behind us. If it wasn't Iraqi it would have been what ever was happening now. Its was a matter of time not situation. The fact that we get all work up about where Bush was during his years as a serviceman, or weather or not Kerry deserves his purple heart speaks volumes to that fact.


Oh and it wasn’t flimsy grounds, the grounds where to make the world a better place, what was flimsy was the idea that Americans would care about something other then their own immediate well being. Hence the need to us something that would get their attention like WMD.
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Admiralbill_gomec
UberAdmiral
gvok
Aug 20 2004, 11:42 AM
I think Bush sqandered the good will of a large percentage of Americans and our allies by forcing an invasion of Iraq on flimsy grounds.

Actually, your guy indicated the same thing.

Just for grins, I'm going to use a source that Somerled would love:

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2004/aug2004/kerr-a12.shtml

To whit:

Quote:
 
Speaking in Arizona on Monday, Kerry declared that “even knowing what we now know,” he would still have cast his vote in the Senate to authorize the Bush administration to invade Iraq. “I would have voted for the authority,” said Kerry. “I believe it was the right authority for the president to have.”
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gvok
Unregistered

Dan:

Reasonable and equally informed minds can disagree on this issue. But consider this, what if instead of invading Iraq we kept the UN inspectors there and increased the pressure containing Saddam. At the same time we funneled more money and troops into Afghanistan focusing on the border regions where the jihadists have taken refuge.

I definitely think more people would support President Bush under those circumstances. I know that I for one would still support him if that were the case.

P.S. I appreciate the civil tone in which you responded to my post.
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ds9074
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Admiral
As you would expect I broadly agree with Gvok, and that includes his comments about civil posts. I think Iraq was a distraction from where we should have been applying our full force. Its a bit like Germany invading Russia before they had finished off Britain and then having to fight on too many fronts at once.
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Minuet
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Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
Maybe in choosing war with Iraq Bush underestimated Americans leftover feelings of confliction over Viet Nam. The differences between the two actions are quite apparent to some, but obviously have not been communicated enough to all.
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Admiralbill_gomec
UberAdmiral
UN inspections started again in November 2002 after a 4 year absence. Saddam had plenty of time to hide anything anywhere. In addition, Hans Blix and his team were being led around by Saddam's people to places they wanted Blix to see.
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gvok
Unregistered

Minuet
Aug 20 2004, 12:57 PM
Maybe in choosing war with Iraq Bush underestimated Americans leftover feelings of confliction over Viet Nam. The differences between the two actions are quite apparent to some, but obviously have not been communicated enough to all.

I think there's some truth to this. Although, the only comparison that really matters is that both Vietnam and Iraq were wars of choice rather than necessity.
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ds9074
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Admiral
Hidden weapons of course are not useable weapons so even if all the inspectors did was make Saddam hide his weapons in hard to find places they were containing the threat. Additionally Saddam knew that if he used any weapons anywhere or was ever found to have any then we would be on him in a flash. So he probably didnt have the immediate capability nor the will to use such weapons. He was not an immediate danger - at least not in my view.
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Minuet
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Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
I don't agree that Iraq was unnessesary.

Despite the lack of actual WMD finds there is absolute proof that Saddam was at least seeking this capability. Blix was doing a poor job of monitoring Iraq. Tell me, if you only go where Saddam authorizes you to go to you think you would find anything? Of course not. The man did not insist on full and free access to go where he would choose to go. The element of suprise was totally removed from the equation. Of course he found nothing on his inspections.

If there were no actual WMD Iraq certainly tried to make it look like there were some. In other words, they asked for it. Don't play Russian Roulette with the biggest superpower in the world. (Someone should tell that to Iran now :loling: )
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gvok
Unregistered

I understand what you mean, but it is not a certainty (looking at it from a cost benefit analysis) that the invasion of Iraq was a good thing let alone a necessity. I would also add that Vietnam was and Iraq potentially will become a quagmire. Again, I can accept that reasonable and fully informed minds can differ on this issue.
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