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| Energy Dependence | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 16 2004, 12:56 PM (383 Views) | |
| Admiralbill_gomec | Aug 17 2004, 11:58 AM Post #31 |
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UberAdmiral
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I'm fully aware of how long it takes to build and start a refinery. This is why we must start now. Current US refinery capacity is around 97%. |
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| Hoss | Aug 17 2004, 12:06 PM Post #32 |
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Don't make me use my bare hands on you.
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Did I tell you that I used to live in Port Arthur, Texas? And that I have worked in several petro-chemical plants? Yes they are huge, yes they are complex and there are thousands of skilled workers all along the gulf coast that are experienced in building and operating the things. I am no longer in that pool of workers as that line of work scared the hell out of me. The scariest job was either at a DuPont chemical plant in the Acrylonitrile unit or at a Texaco MTBE plant. There were dead birds every where at the DuPont plant, people would sometimes get this crap on their coveralls and thier coveralls would just fall apart. There was once an accidental chlorine release in a column that I was working directly under. I was next to a steam pop-off valve and couldn't hear the alarm. The prevailing winds blew the chlorine over a lake and only a few people were hospitalized. I could've easily been killed had it been a calm day. The MTBE plant I was in had this tremendous stainless steal reactor that was nearly 400 ft tall. All of the transducer racks and control valves had stainless steal mesh armor curtains in front of them so that if they blew they wouldn't take the rest of the plant with them. I was working there when they started the thing up for the first time, a very nerve racking time. They had a series of huge bunkered ground flares to burn the crap off in an emergency. I was around when they ran them a few times. It could be heard for miles and at night it lit the entire sky bright orange. I also worked in an enormous paper mill. That is quite a machine to see in action. During all of this I had the revalation that I am already at the peak of my career at age 23 in this line of work. I should go to college, get paid for my mind and get a job that ain't so scary. The worst I've done in my current career is blow the top of an IC.
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| somerled | Aug 17 2004, 12:06 PM Post #33 |
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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^^ Agreed - if the reliance on deisal and petrol is to continue. Trick is convincing the oil companies to invest mega-billions per new refinery, or refinery upgrade , dozens of times over. They wont do it without good prospects of profitability for each investment. |
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| Admiralbill_gomec | Aug 17 2004, 03:41 PM Post #34 |
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UberAdmiral
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Funny that they did it before, but quite often refineries are independent. It is a question of getting the investors to do so, and then fighting the bureaucracy and the lawsuits thanks to the enviro-wienies. |
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| somerled | Aug 18 2004, 07:18 AM Post #35 |
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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^^ Would you be happy about having a massive oil refinery planted in your neighbourhood (say a few blocks away) , and having your favourate waterway potentially polluted into unuseability by it's effluent, not to mention the effect on air quality and land values ? There are reasons why environmental impact statements are mandatory before projects can move to the local and state governments for discussion and approval , especially in green field locations and locations where this kind of industry have not been operating previously. Some of it is irrational (some people oppose development at all costs - the rabid tree hugger brigade), but a lot of the concerns are very logical and well founded. |
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| Minuet | Aug 18 2004, 07:51 AM Post #36 |
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Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
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You are asking this of someone who lives in Houston, Texas? There are huge oil refineries there. |
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| Admiralbill_gomec | Aug 18 2004, 08:42 AM Post #37 |
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UberAdmiral
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It wouldn't bother me a bit. Yes, Min is right... I live in Houston, where 50% of the gasoline used in the United States is refined. Refineries must adhere to the strictest of environmental standards to operate.
This simply doesn't happen. Maybe it did... in the 1960s!
No, all of the enviro-wienie complaints are irrational. They want their cheap gas so they can drive their Honda Insights and Volkswagen Passats, but they don't want it to be anywhere near them. In addition, these are the same people who moan and cry about the eeeeeeevils of nuclear power and then blame their state, the federal government, or Enron because of blackouts. |
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| somerled | Aug 18 2004, 09:51 AM Post #38 |
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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^^ I used the word . I wonder how the other members would feel about that kind of prospect coming into their neighbourhood. |
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| Admiralbill_gomec | Aug 18 2004, 01:21 PM Post #39 |
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UberAdmiral
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Some people might like the jobs... high pay, good benefits. This could explain why Deer Park, Texas, has some of the lowest property taxes and the highest per student school spending (because of refineries paying taxes). |
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| somerled | Aug 20 2004, 08:01 AM Post #40 |
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Admiral MacDonald RN
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^^ Oil companies paying their share of the taxes ? Really ? That is something I would have to see to believe.
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| Admiralbill_gomec | Aug 20 2004, 08:22 AM Post #41 |
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UberAdmiral
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Either you don't know how our tax system works, or you are making a false statement. Which is it? OR, is this more of a "Bush and his cronys in Big Oil don't do anything but rape and pillage the environment to line their own pockets" type of statement? |
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Really ?
That is something I would have to see to believe.

3:24 AM Jul 11