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If I may...; A reply to a cognizant antiIraq argument
Topic Started: May 16 2004, 03:01 PM (442 Views)
Dandandat
Member Avatar
Time to put something here
somerled
May 17 2004, 10:39 AM
Keep in mind that Ben Laden is a monster that your own CIA and government created (when the USSR occupied Afganistan and he was supported by them).

If true - all the more reason for our duty to clean him up, - same went for Saddam.
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Dandandat
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Time to put something here
somerled
May 17 2004, 08:13 PM
We all saw just how good the intelligence that was used to drum up support for the invasion of Iraq was - It was "rock solid" and "incontravertable" and proved nearly 100% wrong / fabricated / sexed up and just plain completely unreliable.

Where is the alarm? What is alarming? - that Iraqi is in the middle of the stomping ground of many terrorist groups- how alarming!

Propaganda? - dispute it, prove to me that Iraqi is not in the middle to of the stomping ground of many terrorist groups, and potentially valuable real estate.
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Dwayne
Profanity deleted by Hoss
Thank you all who recognize the effort I put into this post, but quite honestly, it's merely an outline of all the research I've done to date on the subject.

somerled
 
We all saw just how good the intelligence that was used to drum up support for the invasion of Iraq was - It was "rock solid" and "incontravertable" and proved nearly 100% wrong / fabricated / sexed up and just plain completely unreliable.

That was alarmist ,  so is this stuff.

What makes you think this stuff is any more reliable (given the sources) ?

As for the intelligence, why in the world would French, Russian, Chinese, UN and other INTEL created by other powers back up American INTEL? The fact is, it wouldn't. The UN would have suspended the sanctions, because France, Russia and China wouldn't stand for it. France and Russia stood to make billions of dollars off oil deals once sanctions were lifted.

As for being alarmist...you're damn right it's alarmist, but someone has to sound the alarm. If people don't wake up and pay attention to what is going on, there will only be more Munich Olympic hostage crisises, only more Tehran hostage crisises, only more Bieruts, only more Marine barracks blown up, only more German discotique blown up, only more Lockerbie's, only more Kurdish children killed with poison gas, only more embassy bombings, only more 9-11's and 3-11's, and only more Daniel Pearls and Nick Bergs. All the pie in the sky, peace at all costs type rhetoric that is so favored by many Europeans (present company excluded) and others through out the world, will only leaded to more of the same.

And if you have questions about my sources, then it is your responsibility to find sources the refute mine.

somerled
 
These being
1. The Council for Foreign Relations (Most of the .... errr? "data" came directly from the propoganda held in their pages) an ultra-right wing lobby group.

If there were anything that showed exactly how wacked out you are, this would be it.

The CFR is in no way considered "right wing". In fact, most ring wing extremist consider the CFR part of the left wing ZOG (Zionist Occupational Government), which they claim runs America. You do realize that right wing extremist hate Jews ... right?

Not to mention, the CFR, through its publications and policy statements, was not in favor of opening an Iraqi theatre in the War on Terror.

somerled
 
2. Christian Science Monitor / Houston Chronicle

Again, what's right with CSM and the Houston Chronicle?

somerled
 
3. The SF Chronicle

San Francisco Chronicle has never been considered right wing. In fact there is a web site billed as a "media watchdog and conservative news site, with a focus on the San Francisco Chronicle".

somerled
 
4. Aljazeerah

It's always a pleasure to use the enemies own propaganda arm against itself.

somerled
 
5. Islam Online

See above answer.

somerled
 
6. Slade.net (who ever they are)

It's called Slate, and it is an unargably leftwing web site.

somerled
 
7. Houston 24hr News ?

What's wrong with this? Nothing. I'm citing a cross-section of sources from both left and right leaning and both pro and anti west news sources.

somerled
 
8. Boston Times

Prove the info from the site that I cited in incorrect or factual wrong, and I'll consider changing it.

somerled
 
9. The Indian Express.
See above.


I'm not going to sit here and play this game. Either prove me wrong, or open your eyes to the truth ... there is a war between Islamic fundamentalist and the rest of the world.

Note, I'm not saying all Muslims, just the fundies. Maybe there's no difference in your mind.
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somerled
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Admiral MacDonald RN
I wont be visiting this thread again - it takes too long to open.

I do have things to say though.
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Minuet
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Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
What a suprise.

When confronted with facts Somerled comes up with his usual excuse of being too busy to respond.

Mind you, it does take a lot longer to come up with propaganda then it does to find the truth.
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Dwayne
Profanity deleted by Hoss
Minuet
May 19 2004, 07:56 AM
What a suprise.

When confronted with facts Somerled comes up with his usual excuse of being too busy to respond.

Mind you, it does take a lot longer to come up with propaganda then it does to find the truth.

:whistle:

As long as he goes to the second page, it should not take long to load it at all.

I'd figured he knews this, but doesn't want to spend the responding.
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somerled
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Admiral MacDonald RN
Minuet :
Pull your bloody head in :

You may have a broadband or cable modem at home, but I do not, I only have high speed access at uni and certainly am not going to drive to uni to contribute this particularly noxious thread. So take your little blue pill and chill out.

Why do you think so few people have participated in the discussion on this thread ?

[strike]I have more to say - and will be back in 3 hours (after the lecture) maybe .[/strike]

Dwayne:
What second thread ?

Added later.
All:
Since the other contributers have resorted to personalities rather than addressing the issues raised by Dwayne and since they have nothing of value to add (no new pertinent information or facts - if you can call them facts, as much of the stuff presented is at least 4 or 5 years old or older - a bit like the stuff presented to the UN to justify the invasion of Iraq in the first place) to the debate (they have already lost the debate by default) than I see little value or point in further participation in this thread.

Dwayne : If you want further debate from other people or myself on this thread I recommend opening a less data-transfer intensive followup thread.

That will be all.
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Admiralbill_gomec
UberAdmiral
somerled
May 20 2004, 02:17 AM

Dwayne : If you want further debate from other people or myself on this thread I recommend opening a less data-transfer intensive followup thread.

That will be all.

Does this mean that we salute you, turn about place, and march away? As it was suggested before, get over yourself somerled.


Quote:
 
As for being alarmist...you're damn right it's alarmist, but someone has to sound the alarm. If people don't wake up and pay attention to what is going on, there will only be more Munich Olympic hostage crisises, only more Tehran hostage crisises, only more Bieruts, only more Marine barracks blown up, only more German discotique blown up, only more Lockerbie's, only more Kurdish children killed with poison gas, only more embassy bombings, only more 9-11's and 3-11's, and only more Daniel Pearls and Nick Bergs. All the pie in the sky, peace at all costs type rhetoric that is so favored by many Europeans (present company excluded) and others through out the world, will only leaded to more of the same.


Dwayne raises some very valid points in this quote.

Perhaps Somerled would think differently if his country had been attacked, whether on its soil or at embassies? How many Australians died in the Bali attack?
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Dwayne
Profanity deleted by Hoss
Admiralbill_gomec
May 20 2004, 08:18 AM
somerled
May 20 2004, 02:17 AM

Dwayne : If you want further debate from other people or myself on this thread I recommend opening a less data-transfer intensive followup thread.

That will be all.

Does this mean that we salute you, turn about place, and march away? As it was suggested before, get over yourself somerled.


Quote:
 
As for being alarmist...you're damn right it's alarmist, but someone has to sound the alarm. If people don't wake up and pay attention to what is going on, there will only be more Munich Olympic hostage crisises, only more Tehran hostage crisises, only more Bieruts, only more Marine barracks blown up, only more German discotique blown up, only more Lockerbie's, only more Kurdish children killed with poison gas, only more embassy bombings, only more 9-11's and 3-11's, and only more Daniel Pearls and Nick Bergs. All the pie in the sky, peace at all costs type rhetoric that is so favored by many Europeans (present company excluded) and others through out the world, will only leaded to more of the same.


Dwayne raises some very valid points in this quote.

Perhaps Somerled would think differently if his country had been attacked, whether on its soil or at embassies? How many Australians died in the Bali attack?

I think Somerled is avoiding the point.
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