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Soldiers in Iraq aren't Heroes?; Andy Rooney Opines...
Topic Started: Apr 12 2004, 07:04 PM (840 Views)
Adrian
Lieutenant Commander
Dwayne: A)Sorry this is government; not much glamour there. B)None. Same with Sadaam.
Dan, which abstracts were you referring to?
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Dandandat
Member Avatar
Time to put something here
Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
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Admiralbill_gomec
UberAdmiral
Adrian
Apr 18 2004, 10:35 AM
I don't buy that at all. The Press wants America to fail? Why? No oofense, but this has that Admiral Bill "You're either against (America, national defence, anti-terrorism, ect.) or for it" false choice. What's wrong with saying something could be done better?
Most journalsist label themselves as liberal center on social issues (they are colledge educated) and conservative on ecomic issues (they usually make over $100,000 per year).

I had to laugh when I saw this.

More evidence of the lack of clear thinking from the left.

Most journalists list themselves as "moderate" but are IN FACT far left socialist liberals (either socially or fiscally).

So, are you for America and its survival or against it? None of that, "well, before September 11th" drivel... we're NEVER going back. Either accept it and try to be happy, or sit there and seethe in your anti-Bush rage.
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Adrian
Lieutenant Commander
Dan,
You feel that the cost for the USA of not going to war with Iraq would be our life, liberty, and our pursuit of happiness? How?
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doctortobe
Speak softly, and carry a 57 megaton stick!
In the long term, invading Iraq will save lives. If a democracy can be set up in Iraq, it is inevitable that others will desire the freedoms that Iraqis hold. Already you have the peoples of both Saudi Arabia and Iran nearly in civil war over their governments. They no longer want to be told what to do on threat of death. They want to choose their own path in life.

If Iraq is reformed, then the Saudi and Iranian governments will be under even greater pressure from within. Civil war will soon erupt and, with international help, democratic governments could be cultivated there as well. With this, the powerhouse nations of Islam will know freedom. Their people will be educated, they will know that there is hope in the future and that they can make their lot better in life by working hard, not killing others. With this, the very roots of fundamentalist Islam will be destroyed. Groups like Al Quida will no longer receive the millions of dollars it needs to conduct a campaign of terror against the US because Islam will be so far away from their ideals that people will no longer WANT to give money to them.

It is also likely that Al Quida and other terror groups will start to strike more frequently at Middle Eastern targets as the countries within move towards moderation. This will not make the people go back to fundamentalism out of fear however, it will make them all the more repulsed by Al Quida and its methods.

Hopefully, someday, the Middle East and America will be as good friends as we are currently with Britain. It will be important for America to treat the Middle East with respect and not to flaunt our superpower status at them, but that is going to be true for all our allies.
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Adrian
Lieutenant Commander
I agreee that this is probably the best and truest reason to go to ware with Iraq. But remember we do have a middle east democracy in place and it hasn't influenced its neighbors at all: Turkey.
I believe that the greates curse on the middle east is also its blessing: oil. While it does make a few familes emensely rich and powerful, it also creates an enoumous gulf between the haves and the have nots. This form one of the bases for fundementalism to flourish.
Turkey's lack of this resource (they have only some compared to their neighbors) forced them to grow their markets naturally, in a wide distribution sreading wealth more evenly. Democracy took hold.
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Admiralbill_gomec
UberAdmiral
Kemal Attaturk might have had a little something to do with it, too.
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Adrian
Lieutenant Commander
True, every nation needs leaders. And the "George Washington" of Turkey lead his with a strong hand.
But why no leakage of democratic ideas into the bordering nations? And do these factors mean Iraq won't be democratic? Or if they do, won't infect other nations with democracy?
And why didn't we invade a country with more of a democratic tradition, like Iran (they actually support Al Quieda)?
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doctortobe
Speak softly, and carry a 57 megaton stick!
We invaded Iraq because they were the one country that had a secular leader. If we had invaded a country like Iran, where the leaders are part of the religion. There would have been a much greater civil unrest as it could easily be said that it was a direct attack on Islam. That is not a claim that could be made of Saddam.
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Adrian
Lieutenant Commander
Actually, Syria is a state sponsor of terror (they're the guys that kept Lebanon a shooting gallery for so long and Hezbollah in business) and is a socialist dictatorship. In fact, they also call themselves the Baath party.
So why didn't we invade them?
The only reasons I could think of would be
A) Weapons of Mass Destruction
B) Sadaam was a really, really bad man. Actually, Syria's leaders are just as bad. Okay, we (and whenI say we I meand the administration) just hated Sadaam more.
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