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| Joe the Plumber?; Not a plumber. And not even called Joe | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 17 2008, 06:00 AM (2,530 Views) | |
| Wichita | Nov 5 2008, 07:45 AM Post #166 |
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The Adminstrator wRench
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So, what you are saying is that if a person stands in a public place and asks a question of a public official, it is acceptable for the public person to search through his questioner's personal records to see if he has EVER broken ANY law? And you think that isn't intimidation?
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| Dr. Noah | Nov 5 2008, 07:47 AM Post #167 |
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Sistertrek's Asian Correspondant
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Really? Obama searched through the guy's records? I don't think so. More than likely it was the media. And isn't it intimidation to go up to a public official and try to make him look bad by lying about your situation? The guy is a celebrity now. He sought the limelight, and it bit him in the butt. Lesson learned. Don't lie on national TV if you don't want someone to call you on it. Edited by Dr. Noah, Nov 5 2008, 07:48 AM.
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| Wichita | Nov 5 2008, 07:49 AM Post #168 |
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The Adminstrator wRench
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OK since you have added to your comment since I posted .... Again, the entire piece was recorded so it should be easy for you to demonstrate what he said and provide documentation of what you consider to be a lie. He did say he was a plumber. He didn't say he was a licensed plumber so that is not a lie. Having hopes is not a "lie" - if it is, Obama's whole candidacy would also be a "lie". Dreams may be unrealistic but they aren't "lies" |
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| Wichita | Nov 5 2008, 07:56 AM Post #169 |
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The Adminstrator wRench
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Noah, putting words in my mouth already? I never said Obama searched through his records. It is well documented already who did the searching. One clerk has already been charged with a crime for doing so. The person who authorized the search of his child support records is under fire for having authorized the search. She claimed that it was standard operating procedure, but no one else says that it is. The person who was directed to make the search has said that, after the fact, she was instructed to write and e-mail that was less than honest about why she did so. She was concerned about her own legal jeopardy and has gone directly to the agency who is investigating the situation.
Again, you haven't demonstrated what lie was supposedly told. However, I would disgaree with the premise. Public officials should be able to respond to tough questions (not that I think that the particular question Joe asked could be characterized as "tough"). And if going out on your own front lawn qualifies as seeking celebrity ....
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| Dr. Noah | Nov 5 2008, 07:56 AM Post #170 |
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Sistertrek's Asian Correspondant
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Whatever, he said what he said to make Obama look bad and did it on national TV. So don't be upset because the media decided to look into what he said. If you or I seek the limelight of national television to make a presidential nominee look bad the same would happen. Don't blame this on democrats. This is the media. Hell, I can be a plumber without a licence. I've fixed drains and garbage disposals several times. I don't claim to be a plumber. I could say I'm planning to buy some business for a quarter of a million dollars without even having the money to pay a little over a thousand dollars in taxes. But that doesn't make it realistic. It's a lie. He has no means to do so. If he did, it would probably take over eight years on a non-licenced plumber's salary to do so. BTW: Going out on your front lawn in front of national television cameras. Yeah, speaking to the national TV is seeking the limelight. Get over it already. McCain tried to use this guy as an example of an "average guy" who just happens to be able to afford to buy a quarter of a million dollar business. If a candidate is going to use him as a barganing chip, he should be sure his story is straight. Edited by Dr. Noah, Nov 5 2008, 07:59 AM.
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| Wichita | Nov 5 2008, 08:12 AM Post #171 |
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The Adminstrator wRench
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So you ARE saying that if a person asks a question of a political official they forfeit all rights to privacy despite there being no evidence whatsoever of probable cause of a crime being committed? I have to disagree and I do find the concept intimidating to free speech. And I would not describe standing in my front yard when a political campaing chooses my street to go door to door as ME being the one who is seeking the limelight. And, you do have the right to not call yourself a plumber. That doesn't mean someone else can't so if he so chooses. And, having dreams doesn't make someone a liar. I seriously doubt that Michael Dell's parents thought he was going to end up where he is today when he started out. |
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| Dr. Noah | Nov 5 2008, 08:15 AM Post #172 |
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Sistertrek's Asian Correspondant
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Yeah, I forgot. The guy's name isn't even Joe. So that's a lie. So I can call myself an electrician because I wired a couple rooms in my house? I can call myself a plumber because I fixed a kichen sink and a jacuzzi from time to time. Wow, how professional. It's a lie to say you are going to buy a million dollar business when you can't even afford to pay a thousand dollars in taxes. It's a self-delusional lie, but a lie nonetheless. Tough toenails. He tried to make someone look bad and it bit him back. Serves him right. |
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| Wichita | Nov 5 2008, 08:24 AM Post #173 |
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The Adminstrator wRench
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I think if you GOOGLE it, you can find out what he ACTUALLY said in the interview. For now, I will just say that I still disagree with you. I think that there should be evidence of probable cause of a crime being committed BEFORE the government searches through the records of a private citizen and that the information should only be released if it comes to a trial - not simply released to the media for, apparently, just for the heck of it. |
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| Dwayne | Nov 5 2008, 08:26 AM Post #174 |
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Profanity deleted by Hoss
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As the political pressure ramps up, more Joe the Plumbers will need to be put in their place... It doesn't look pretty. |
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| Minuet | Nov 5 2008, 09:29 AM Post #175 |
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Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
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I don't know why people are coming to Joe's defence. The man is reveling in the publicity. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081031/ap_on_re_us/joe_the_plumber_publicist I heard about his retention of the PR firm about a week ago and this article is about a week or so old. It's not new news that the man wants to put out a country music album. So, those who question his commitment to buy a plumbing firm when he is not a licensed plumber are not stretching things much. In light of his public aspirations I don't think it's that much of a stretch to suggest that he himself may have been the origilnal leak of his address to the blogs. As for the other inquiries into his life by the local government officials - none of the articles I have read have indicated the political affiliation of the official involved. It is not fact by a long shot that this person is a Democrat. One or two people here seem convinced that she was a Democrat - but this should not be taken as fact. The only fact that I see is that Joe the Plumber is reveling in the spotlight and totally enjoying the notoriety it has brought. I don't feel sorry for him in the least. |
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| Admiralbill_gomec | Nov 5 2008, 09:30 AM Post #176 |
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UberAdmiral
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Good for him. |
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| Minuet | Nov 5 2008, 09:31 AM Post #177 |
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Fleet Admiral Assistant wRench, Chief Supper Officer
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I never said it was bad
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| RTW | Nov 5 2008, 11:15 AM Post #178 |
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Vice Admiral
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Wow Noah. Just .... wow. |
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| Wichita | Nov 6 2008, 06:38 AM Post #179 |
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The Adminstrator wRench
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Minuet, in the US, a person who is the victim of a crime has the right to sue the person who committed the crime for damages. If Joe chooses to do so, he most likely WILL win enough money from the state of Ohio to purchase that business. Just because the Democratic Governor (which, by the way, IS A FACT that he is a Democrat) doesn't think the investigation into his private records is politically motivated does not mean that the courts will agree and Joe has every legal right to sue. There were actually four different investigations into Joe's records. One woman has already been charged with a crime for doing so. The woman who authorized the investigation into his child support records gave the maximum amount of money to Obama's campaign. Donation records are, by law, public so that is a fact. Now, you are right. The fact that she gave the maximum amount of money to the Democratic candidate does not make her a Democrat. However, it would seem to be pretty convincing evidence that she supports the candidacy of the person who Joe asked the question of originally. Everything you say about Joe AFTER THE FACT may be completely correct. It is, however, irrelevent to the arguement that I am making. My point is and had always been that he had a right to privacy from his state records being released without probable cause of a crime being committed. If, after the fact of his rights being violated, he chooses to capitalize on the release of his records, it doesn't bother me in the slightest. I will point out one last thing. When and if he chooses to sue the state, it will cost me PERSONALLY money as a taxpayer in the state of Ohio if he wins. . Nonetheless, I believe that he has a right to do so and will most likely win. |
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| Dwayne | Nov 6 2008, 07:38 AM Post #180 |
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Profanity deleted by Hoss
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^^^ He SHOULD sue. A message needs to be sent to the democrats. |
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